August 26, 2009
Maine tried ObamaCare - not successful

The fifty states of our union can show us how different approaches work. One state tries Obama's dream while another avoids restrictions. What are the results. Several states have tried Obama-like health care takeover; Maine did and people came out of private insurance to the state, the costs went up and the number of uninsured dropped then climbed again.

WSJ.com:

Want a preview of ObamaCare in action? Sneak a look at what has happened in Maine. In 2003, the state to great fanfare enacted its own version of universal health care. Democratic Governor John Baldacci signed the plan into law with a bevy of familiar promises. By 2009, it would cover all of Maine's approximately 128,000 uninsured citizens. System-wide controls on hospital and physician costs would hold down insurance premiums. There would be no tax increases. The program was going to provide insurance for everyone and save businesses and patients money at the same time.

After five years, fiscal realities as brutal as the waves that crash along Maine's famous coastline have hit the insurance plan. The system that was supposed to save money has cost taxpayers $155 million and is still rising.

Here's how the program was supposed to work. Two government programs would cover the uninsured. First the legislature greatly expanded MaineCare, the state's Medicaid program. Today Maine families with incomes of up to $44,000 a year are eligible; 22% of the population is now in Medicaid, roughly twice the national average.

Then the state created a "public option" known as DirigoChoice. (Dirigo is the state motto, meaning "I Lead.") This plan would compete with private plans such as Blue Cross. To entice lower income Mainers to enroll, it offered taxpayer-subsidized premiums. The plan's original funding source was $50 million of federal stimulus money the state got in 2003. Over time, the plan was to be "paid for by savings in the health-care system." This is precisely the promise of ObamaCare. Maine saved by squeezing payments to hospitals and physicians.

The program flew off track fast.
At its peak in 2006, only about 15,000 people had enrolled in the DirigoChoice program. That number has dropped to below 10,000, according to the state's own reporting. About two-thirds of those who enrolled already had insurance, which they dropped in favor of the public option and its subsidies. Instead of 128,000 uninsured in the program today, the actual number is just 3,400. Despite the giant expansions in Maine's Medicaid program and the new, subsidized public choice option, the number of uninsured in the state today is only slightly lower that in 2004 when the program began.

Why did this happen? Among the biggest reasons is a severe adverse selection problem: The sickest, most expensive patients crowded into DirigoChoice, unbalancing its insurance pool and raising costs. That made it unattractive for healthier and lower-risk enrollees. And as a result, few low-income Mainers have been able to afford the premiums, even at subsidized rates.

This problem was exacerbated because since the early 1990s Maine has required insurers to adhere to community rating and guaranteed issue, which requires that insurers cover anyone who applies, regardless of their health condition and at a uniform premium. These rules--which are in the Obama plan--have relentlessly driven up insurance costs in Maine, especially for healthy people.

The Maine Heritage Policy Center, which has tracked the plan closely, points out that largely because of these insurance rules, a healthy male in Maine who is 30 and single pays a monthly premium of $762 in the individual market; next door in New Hampshire he pays $222 a month. The Granite State doesn't have community rating and guaranteed issue.

We can join Maine with Obama's takeover and high costs or look at what New Hampshire and other states are doing.

5:26 PM - I am turning off comments because civil discourse ended around 10 AM this morning. I have never done this before in the 5 years I have been a contributer. I think the existing comments will stay. I know that the most repulsive ones will disappear.

Posted by Ron Hebron at August 26, 2009 06:26 AM | Email This
Comments
1. Better watch out. You'll get called a "racist" for pointing this kind of thing out.

Seriously though, yes, but the libs will just say (as they do with gun-control failures) "It needs to be nation-wide!". Or as with Communism, "It just hasn't been done right yet!"

Or whatever excuse they'll make. I can't wait to hear it.

Posted by: Gary on August 26, 2009 06:46 AM
2. Isn't Maine part of Canada? :)

Posted by: Duffman on August 26, 2009 06:59 AM
3. Yes Duffy, Maine is the "57th" State that Obama visited during the campaign.

Posted by: Smokie on August 26, 2009 07:20 AM
4. Government shouldn't compete with the Private Sector at any level. To do so is Socialism/Communism/Fascism. Only, the Private Sector/Capitalism produces sustainable Wealth and the highest Lifestyle for its Citizens.

Posted by: Daniel on August 26, 2009 07:36 AM
5. Hawaii tried Obamacare... Result: Failure
Massachussetts tried Obamacare...Result: Failure
Main tried Obamacare... Result: Failure

"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results" ~ Albert Einstein

Posted by: Rick D. on August 26, 2009 07:40 AM
6. This is so confusing....

According to Ron and the WSJ, a public option would be just like Maine's DirigoCare: a total failure that few would select.

But Chuck Grassley tells us 129 million people would select a national public option and it would destroy private insurance.

So, which is it? (Hint: maybe it's neither)

Posted by: scottd on August 26, 2009 08:33 AM
7. Scottd,

Perhaps it's both? It will destroy private insurance and result increased costs and decreased service, thereby being a failure?

Posted by: Shanghai Dan on August 26, 2009 08:36 AM
8. Why is this a good idea when you call it Romneycare but a bad idea when you call it Obamacare?

This is all about putting on the hate on Obama and getting Republicans elected for you people.


Socialized Medicine is bad regardless of which of our TWO socialist parties gives it to us!

I believe that Obama will fail only for the Republicans to revive much of these policies when their guy gets in. After all it took Nixon to go to China. And let us not forget who did the first bailout.

Socialized Medicine will become a Republican legacy. That is why you are fighting so hard for it to be defeated under Obama. You want to put it in yourselves.

You Republicans are low life trash.

I am against BOTH Romneycare and Obamacare for after all they are basically the same thing.

But you keep on putting that hate on Obama. Because for you that is all it is about.

And thank god Darcy Burner didn't win last year for after all she might have voted for cap and trade which is bad, but only bad when a democrat votes for it. Otherwise it is good.

You are a bunch of trash!

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 08:41 AM
9. "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results" ~ Albert Einstein

You mean just like voting for Bush.

Yeah, the last Bush was bad but this Bush will be better.

The Definition of insanity is voting Republican thinking that conservative policies will result from it.

Republicans are NOT the solution for the Democrats but the cause of them.

Bush Clinton Bush Obama ? It's a pattern we need to break not reinforce.

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 08:46 AM
10. Dan: Is that what happened in Maine?

Posted by: scottd on August 26, 2009 08:47 AM
11. "You Republicans are low life trash."

"You are a bunch of trash!"

...and you were doing so well. Your point has been nullified by your complimentary style of speech. :)

Posted by: Duffman on August 26, 2009 08:47 AM
12. Whatever Duffman.

Despite the polls you are going to lose next year. Because as much as we hate Obama you can't beat something with nothing.

And that is what you Republicans are, nothing. And unlike in the past, this generation of Republicans would rather stay home than vote for a RINO!

Perhaps by 2012 you will have your act together or perhaps by then a new party will emerge to defeat you.

But the surest way to Socialized Medicine is a Republican victory. All the stuff you are putting the hate on under Obamacare you will be promoting under Romneycare.

Sometimes you can be right for the wrong reasons. Obamacare is bad. But so is Romneycare. In fact Obamacare is Romneycare.

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 08:56 AM
13. Mom?...is that YOU?

Posted by: Duffman on August 26, 2009 08:58 AM
14. And unlike in the past, this generation of Republicans would rather stay home than vote for a RINO!

This generation of conservatives I mean.

Staying home is an Option!

Electing Republicans so they can "go to China" on health care isn't.

We need a new party. Republicans are a bunch of sellouts!

Obamacare is Romneycare!

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 08:59 AM
15. Bush gave us the first Bailout. And McCain voted FOR IT!

There's not a dime worth of difference between the two parties.

SO, let's stop tearing the country apart in this "wrestling match" when we don't really mean it. In the end we will have socialized medicine. The only question remaining is will we be calling it Romneycare or Obamacare!

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 09:03 AM
16. Finally a commenter more loony than Demo Kid.

Posted by: Jeff B. on August 26, 2009 09:04 AM
17. NIXON SIGNED IN AFFIRMATIVE ACTION

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 09:05 AM
18. "I had to destroy capitalism to save it."

George W. Bush.


Until you admit that Republicans are not the solution but part of the problem you have absolutely no credibility.

Obamacare IS ROMNEYCARE!

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 09:15 AM
19. Beth;

Calm down lady. I have never seen anyone on this site say they were in favor of Romneycare. Where do you get the idea that the only reason people here are against Obamacare is because of, Obama? Maybe the merits of government run health care are lacking. So in your view I can't be against it without hating Obama too? That is typical lefty think and that as we all know is fueled by immaturity. Are you 19?

Posted by: REBEL on August 26, 2009 09:21 AM
20. Beth: Since you seem to have gone completely bonkers due to my comment, I'll address it. You're right, Romneycare is Obamacare as tried in Mass. The result was a failed policy.

Personally, I like Romney and felt he was the only qualified candidate in this past Presidential election. He was wrong on trying to implement what he did in Massachussetts, but consider what that state is...A very BLUE state that consistently vote for some of the most liberal Senators and Congressman in the body Congress- Kennedy, Fwank, Kerry. Being a Republican, he still needed to listen to his constituents in his governance of the state didn't he? He implemented it and it failed as you readily admit. Sometimes it takes hard love to give the people what they want only to have reality set in once its implemented.

So where's the beef?


Posted by: Rick D. on August 26, 2009 09:53 AM
21. Whoa...Rick - you one brave mo-fo! :)

Posted by: Duffman on August 26, 2009 09:56 AM
22. Socialized Medicine is Bad.

Unless a Republican is promoting it.

Then it's good.

But Obama is Democrat.

Therefore Socialized Medicine is bad.

Bad, bad ole Obamacare.

YEAH ROMNEYCARE!

Let's stop Socialized Medicine NOW! Let's promote socialized medicine later.

Whatever. You fools have no credibility.

But at least you stopped Darcy Burner. Because she would have voted for cap and trade. And cap and trade is bad.

That is unless....

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 09:57 AM
23. You are a bunch of trash!

Thanks beth. Now wipe that spittle off of your chin and get back to your dishes...

Posted by: Alphabet Soup on August 26, 2009 09:57 AM
24. @ 21 Duffman: When you take the emotionalism out of her responses, she ends up agreeing with what I said to begin with.

...color me confused :-)

Posted by: Rick D. on August 26, 2009 10:07 AM
25. Unlike you Rick I hate Obama for what he stand for. I don't hate him just because he is a Democrat.

You do.

I hate Romneycare as well as Obamacare for they are the same.

You just hate Obamacare.

You are a partisan hack WHO WILL BE RESPONSIBLE for getting socialized medicine into America. It just will be four years from now and you will be calling it something else. And you will probably be saying we had to kill America's healthcare system to save it or some crap like that.

REMEMBER Bush did the first bailout and McCain voted for it.

And you are nothing but a low life!

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 10:11 AM
26. Beth, my dear - let me offer a possible suggestion. :)

Posted by: Duffman on August 26, 2009 10:12 AM
27. Bad, bad, bad socialized medicine.

Until the republicans propose it.

Then good, good, good socialized medicine.

WE LOVE SOCIALIZED MEDICINE.

IT'S OBAMA WE HATE

---Sound Politics.

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 10:15 AM
28. It ain't beth's "time of the month." WIth moronic hatred like that, it's her time of the DECADE.

Posted by: hinton on August 26, 2009 10:19 AM
29. And that is what I am looking at. THE DECADE. I am not looking at one or even two election cycles.

And when you look back at the Decade, Obama couldn't be doing now what he is doing if it wasn't for Bush and what he did.

You only have yourselves to blame.

You might win this fight now only to lose it later.

But for you I guess it wouldn't be considered a lost because you couldn't give a damn about defeating socialized Medicine. You just want to defeat Obama.

You don't hate socialized medicine. You hate Obama.

Obamacare IS Romneycare!

Posted by: Betb on August 26, 2009 10:24 AM
30. It is so nice to see that the old and tired meme of anyone opposing a Democratic policy is a bigot is still operative in the New Messianic era we are embarked upon.

Posted by: FurryOldGuyJeans on August 26, 2009 10:25 AM
31. FurryOldGuyJeans - that's why we call it "Post-Reason America". beth and dave are charter members...;'}

Posted by: Alphabet Soup on August 26, 2009 10:34 AM
32. We killed capitalism to save it.

George W. Bush.

It took Nixon to go to China. Not necessarily saying it was a bad foreign policy move but still, it took Nixon to go to China.


We will have Socialized Medicine in America within 10 years.

But I think Obama will not be the one who will be successful in putting it in.

It will be the Republicans.

Because just like Cap and Trade is good if it's a Republican who votes for it, the only thing bad about Obamacare is the Obama. Change that. Call it, oh I don't know Romneycare and it is good.

"He had good ideas"

Ralph Munroe Republican Secretary of State in reference to Theodore Bundy.

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 10:36 AM
33. This is such a wrestling match.

The same people who are against Obamacare today will be its most ardent supporters tomorrow.

That is... when the idea comes from the Republicans.

Or.. I should say when it comes from the Republicans...AGAIN!

Obamacare IS Romneycare!

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 10:44 AM
34. Unlike you Rick I hate Obama for what he stand for. I don't hate him just because he is a Democrat.

Wrong. I don't hate Obama at all.

You just hate Obamacare.

If I thought you were capable of rational thought, I'd expand on what I wrote at 20, but why waste my time.

And you are nothing but a low life!

..and you need professional anger management counseling...

Posted by: Rick D. on August 26, 2009 10:44 AM
35. Rick...

Maybe your friend Larry Corrigan could recommend one?

How's Sid by the way?

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 10:50 AM
36. Someone seems to be very conveniently forgetting that debacle known as HillaryCareŠ, which was forced on the American people by whom? Sure wasn't Romney the last time I checked.

ObamaCareŠ is a direct descendant of HillaryCareŠ, not RomneyCareŠ.

But hey, why let facts stand in the way of a full-on foaming at the mouth frothy rant.

Posted by: FurryOldGuyJeans on August 26, 2009 10:51 AM
37. Hillarycare was bad.

Because she is a Democrat.

But Romney is a Republican

And a Mormon (dumb, dumb, dumb, dumb, dub).

So Romneycare is good.

Yeah Romneycare!

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 11:06 AM
38. Romney is a direct descendant from Mormons.

http://vodpod.com/watch/13713-south-park-ep-712-all-about-mormons-video

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 11:13 AM
39. Rick D. if you don't hate Obama that makes you a bad person.

I knew with Rick here we were dealing with a RINO who's only problem with Obama is that he is a Democrat.

Rick wishes that Obama was a Republican.

Posted by: Fred on August 26, 2009 11:19 AM
40. Rick would LOVE OBAMACARE if Obama was an Republican.

That is what it is all about for him.

After all he loves Ronmeycare and Romneycare IS Obamacare!

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 11:21 AM
41. You mean Obama's....NOT a republican? Oh My! I really screwed up. :)

Posted by: Duffman on August 26, 2009 11:22 AM
42. If he was you would be the first to defend him.

After all you are such a fan of socialists. As long as they call themselves Republicans.

By the way I hear they are going to do a program about Reichert called 24. But instead of how they currently show one hour per episode, each episode is going to be one year.


"I remember he had great ideas"

Ralph Munroe remembering his political ally Ted Bundy.

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 11:27 AM
43. I admit it was easy for you to be fooled Duffman such McCain spent the whole campaign AGREEING WITH OBAMA.

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 11:29 AM
44. someone is either off their meds or on crack.

hard to tell which. might be simply a member of acorn.

Posted by: dan on August 26, 2009 11:30 AM
45. The hardware stores must have had a big sale on broad brushes since a couple of posters are just SOOOO fond of using them.

Posted by: FurryOldGuyJeans on August 26, 2009 11:32 AM
46. Let's see Beth...McCain agreed with Obama; but Palin disagreed with Obama...ergo McCain obviously disagreed with Palin...NO WONDER the republicans lost. Is that what you're getting at?

Posted by: Duffman on August 26, 2009 11:33 AM
47. Who said:

"I had to destroy capitalism to save it".

A) Bill Clinton

B) George W. Bush

C) Barrak Obama.

Who Opened up China.


A) Eugene McCarthy

B) Richard Nixon.

Who signed in Affirmative Action Laws.

A) Richard Nixon

B) Jimmy Carter.


Who will most likely give us socialized medicine

A) Barak Obama

B) Mitt Romney.


Who is the more dangerous

A) The Wolf

B) The Wolf in Sheep's Clothing.


Who has no credibility.

Sound Politics.

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 11:38 AM
48. Wow! I'm getting a headache...where's the Propofol. :(

Posted by: Duffman on August 26, 2009 11:42 AM
49. McCain spent more time during that campaign attacking his supporters than he ever did Obama. IN fact in the debates he seemed to be in awe and in agreement with Obama.

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 11:44 AM
50. Beth, Dave, and Fred;
Why don't you lyin' scumbags just admit you're Democrats and quit trying to come off as some disaffected Republican. You are so obvious. What is really sad, especially concerning Beth, is that she said some things that are somewhat true concerning Republicans and their penchant for putting forward RINO's all the time. Are they RINO's only because they don't act conservative enough for ya? I really don't know anymore what a Republican is supposed to stand for. I seem to align more and more with Libertarians. One thing for sure is that the R's don't seem to be for limited government.

Posted by: REBEL on August 26, 2009 11:50 AM
51. dave @ 48:

The last time I looked Romney was not the POTUS, so it is really a stretch that he would be able to achieve that great feat of giving the US as a whole socialized medicine.

Jimmy Obama (or would that be Barack Carter?) sure is firing on all cylinders trying to do it, in spite of all the evidence that it would be a total unmitigated disaster.

Posted by: FurryOldGuyJeans on August 26, 2009 11:50 AM
52. The last time I looked Romney was not the POTUS, so it is really a stretch that he would be able to achieve that great feat of giving the US as a whole socialized medicine.

Jimmy Obama (or would that be Barack Carter?) sure is firing on all cylinders trying to do it, in spite of all the evidence that it would be a total unmitigated disaster.

Posted by: FurryOldGuyJeans on August 26, 2009 11:51 AM
53. The one thing that Obama can't do is "destroy capitalism to save it".

Bush beat him to it!

That's a legacy that Republicans are going to alway have.

Since we already have the legacy of that we really don't need the legacy of being the party that gave America Socialized Medicine.

That we can give to Obama.

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 12:01 PM
54. Obamacare IS Romneycare!

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 12:03 PM
55. Obamacare is bad.

Because it's the Democrats.

Otherwise it's good.

Just like cap and trade is bad

Until a Republican votes for it.

Socialism is bad.

Unless it's the Republicans giving it to us.

Then it's good.

It's good to kill capitalism.

As long as you are a Republican doing it.

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 12:10 PM
56. Since POTUS linked the medical plan to the postal service, I'll do it too.
The cost of postage seems to go up 5% a year. Is he squeezing the letter carriers or something to keep that in check? Wanna bet that's the floor for 'Bamacare increases?
And how does the post office keep UPS and FedEx honest?

Posted by: PC on August 26, 2009 12:18 PM
57. I was in a bar watching one of the debates and after one of the many compliments that McCain gave Obama a guy shouted out hey McCain if you love Obama so much YOU SHOULD VOTE FOR HIM.

The whole bar started laughing.

There isn't a dime's worth of difference between the Republicans and the Democrats. Oh, they can put on a good "wrestling match" once in a while but we all know it's just for show.

Posted by: Hank on August 26, 2009 12:18 PM
58. Alright Beth, we get it. BFD. So you think that if you use some kind of whacked out reverse psychology on us, we will start supporting Obamacare, thinking that since we all think O care will fail we would want it to happen on the D's watch, and since truthfully you really like O care you can trick us into helping you get what you want. Very devious of you Beth.

Posted by: REBEL on August 26, 2009 12:20 PM
59. It seems that everyone here agrees that obamacare is bad news. Some of you (dave/beth - same person?) point out that romneycare may be similar with similar problems.
Fair enough. And no, most conservatives will not support it. In fact that's going to be Romney's most difficult selling points in the primaries.
But the posting was about the maine debacle. It seems clear that every attempt at obamacare-like models lead to abject failure.

Posted by: ron on August 26, 2009 12:21 PM
60. To Save the Health Care System I had to destroy it.

Mitt Romney 2013


Since we are going to have it any way in a few years I say let Obama have it.

We are just fighting about what to call it.

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 12:27 PM
61. Hank; Amen.

Posted by: REBEL on August 26, 2009 12:27 PM
62. We have government run healthcare in the uk and its something americans shudn't go for. We all get stuck in long waiting lists for anything that isn't life threatening immediately. For life threatening conditions they essentially ration the healthcare. In practice there is a limit as to how much they will spend per person, and there are also (unofficially at least) ages beyond which you won't get certain proceedures done. They basically ration healthcare because the system can't cope.
I think universal healthcare is a moral need, but in practice in the uk at least, it is universaly limited healthcare at best, and age-approved healthcare at worst.

Posted by: robert on August 26, 2009 12:28 PM
63. Sounds like the uk has palin's 'death panels' after all!!

Posted by: ron on August 26, 2009 12:33 PM
64. Did you see how McCain's people all attacked Palin after the election? THEY HATED HER.

But that was the one time during the campaign where you saw a sustained rise in the polls. But then McCain had to ruin it by voting for the bailout.

Once McCain voted for the bailouts he lost the traction he had gained with Palin.

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 12:43 PM
65. All these people here don't hate Obamacare.

Not really.

They hate that the Democrats are in power.

They would LOVE Obamacare.

If the Republicans were in power.

Of course then they wouldn't be calling it Obamacare.

They would, perhaps call it, oh, I don't know....

ROMNEYCARE!

Remember Obamacare IS Romneycare!

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 12:55 PM
66. It'll be a nice change when the little, bored of summer kiddies posting on the blogs are in school getting the full indoctrination that only the NEA and WEA can provide.

"...failure is not an option"... unless it's the Government running the program. At that point, failure becomes the only possible results-based outcome by default.

Posted by: Rick D. on August 26, 2009 01:01 PM
67. Obamacare IS ROMNEYCARE Rick.

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 01:07 PM
68. Obamacare is bad.

Bad, bad Obamacare.

Romneycare is good.

Good, good, Romneycare.

Cap and trade is bad.

Bad bad cap and trade.

Oops, I mean Cap and trade is good, good good Cap and trade.

I AM SO SICK OF THIS PARTISAN CRAP!

I am tired of you people who only hate Obamacare because Obama is for it. And you only hate Obama because he is not a Republican.

There's not a dime's worth of difference between the Republican and Democrats. Perhaps a nickel's worth but a nickel isn't worth fighting over.

I really don't care if you guys call it Obamacare or Romneycare. All the rest is just a Wrestling Match. And I ain't a fan of wrestling.

We are going to have Socialized Medicine within 10 years. The only thing we are fighting over here is who will get the credit.

Isn't "Destroying Capitalism to Save Capitalism" enough credit for the Republican party?

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 01:37 PM
69. Sorry to get off topic, but will someone please pass the scotch?

Posted by: Jack on August 26, 2009 01:48 PM
70. Obama will get the credit with 'honary credit' going to the efforts of the late Sen Edward Kennedy and 'trailing credit' (to a lesser degree) to Mrs Clinton. This will happen when Congress re-convenes and certainly before the end of the year. Bet you a Brazilian Budweiser on it. :)

Posted by: Duffman on August 26, 2009 01:50 PM
71. I don't even think there's a nickel's worth of difference.

It's all a Wresting Match. But the "Bad Wrestler" and "Good Wrestler" are really friends and go to the bar across the street afterwards and laughs at the fools who bought the act.

You are the fools who bought the act. You get so excited about the act. But in the end it is THEY who are getting the last laugh

For Obamacare is Romneycare and believe it or not the "Bad Wrestler" and "The Good Wrestler" are really close friends.

You are just like a bunch of wrestling fans. Go Romneycare kick Obamacare's ass! Win that belt!

Yeah, whatever. You are a bunch of rejects.

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 01:53 PM
72. Did I miss where anybody on here said that "Romneycare" was a good thing? Or is it just the voices in Beth/Dave's head that are saying that?

Care to point out where anybody said that Romneycare was good thing Beth/Dave?

Posted by: Ken on August 26, 2009 01:55 PM
73. Could be worse, folks...you could be married to this. :)

Posted by: Duffman on August 26, 2009 01:56 PM
74. On this corner we have in the Red white and Blue tanks ROMNEY CARE!

Yeah.. Yeah...

On this corner we have in the Red tanks OBAMA CARE!

Boooo

But wait they look exactly alike. I think they are twins.

You're crazy. They are wearing the different trunks. One calls himself Obama Care and the other calls himself Romney Care.

But other than that they look just alike.

You don't know what you are talking about. They hate each other.

Actually I saw them after last night's match across the street. They were laughing it up together like the best of buds.

You are crazy. Wresting is real.

Romney Care Yeah! Obama Care Booo!

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 02:04 PM
75. These Republicans are just like Wrestling fans.

And God help you when you tell them that the Wrestling is just for show.

If they knew how the Republican elected officials get together with their FRIENDS the Democratic elected leaders and laugh over how people actually buy the act.

In the end modern politics is just a wrestling act and if we don't get this plan with the Democrats we are sure to get it with the Republicans. All the rest is just for show.

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 02:11 PM
76. But, don't foget 'Beth' this is the 'greatest show' on the face of the earth...and you know it! :)

Posted by: Duffman on August 26, 2009 02:14 PM
77. Cap and trade is bad.

Bad, bad, bad, bad.

Ooops!

I mean cap and trade is good.

Good, good, good, good.

Yeah Romneycare!

Boo Obamacare!

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 02:15 PM
78. Thank God Darcy Burner didn't win.

For she would have voted for Cap and Trade.

And that would have been bad.

I mean it would have been bad if she voted for it.

Otherwise voting for it is good!

Just like Romneycare is good and Obamacare is bad even though Obamacare IS Romneycare!

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 02:21 PM
79. No Republican/Conservative would be for Cap and Tax even if the sun was supernova-ing and filling up 3/4 of the sky (and raising the average temp. 3 degrees celsius).

Posted by: ajday on August 26, 2009 02:29 PM
80. ajday perhaps you didn't get the memo.

Or perhaps you just don't live in our area.

All good conservatives support Cap and Trade.

Unless, you live in another area. Perhaps an area where a Democrat voted for it.

Then you would be correct. All good conservatives oppose Cap and Trade.

So, whether Cap and Trade is good or not depends on where you personally live.

And Remember...

Go Romneycare! Kick Obamacare's butt. After all the Wrestling Championship is on the line.

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 02:35 PM
81. Yep,

It is so important that WHEN this Socialized Medicine is enacted it isn't called Obamacare.

It is so important for it to be the Republicans who will Destroy health care to save it.

After all we were so effective in killing capitalism to save capitalism. What we did for the bailouts we can do for health care.

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 02:43 PM
82. OMG! Where did this bizarre Dave and Beth show come from? Are they real, or cartoon characters come to life enough to type?????

Posted by: katomar on August 26, 2009 02:50 PM
83. Could be worse, folks...you could be married to this. :)

OK that was funny duffman!

Posted by: Alphabet Soup on August 26, 2009 02:55 PM
84. I have a friend who was a wrestler in the early eighties. He would dress up in Arab garb and call himself the "Iranian Kid". He was the Terror from Tehran and he would sometimes beat the "Yankee Doodle Avenger" but he would always get a worse butt kicking in the end.

I hope that I am not ruining it for anyone but these matches they put on were just for show. The "Iranian Kid" (really from New Jersey) and the "Yankee Doodle Avenger" would say some god awful things to each other and when you saw them in the ring they seem to beat the crap out of each other. You would think they despised each other.

But actually since I was friends with "the Iranian Kid" I got to go out drinking with them afterwards and he and the "Yankee Doodle Avenger" were real good friends. The "Yankee Doodle Avenger" actually named one of his kids after the "Iranian Kid" (his real name of course). And the "Iranian Kid" made the "Yankee Doodle Avenger" godfather to one of his kids (didn't know that Muslims had Godfathers huh well that's another thing despite what he said in the ring he was really Catholic).

Lots of the time when I, the "Iranian Kid", and the "Yankee Doodle Avenger" were drinking together along with many the other wrestlers they would laugh at how riled up they could get the audience.

That is what I see when I look at all the heat them there Repugs are putting upon Obama. This health care plan may be bad, but is it really so much worse than what Romney proposed?

But it all makes for good show, though doesn't it? Helps to bring money into the coffers.

Posted by: Ben on August 26, 2009 03:06 PM
85. I think I remember those to wrestlers and they HATED each other! They despised each other! You say they were close friends. You say they went behind their fans backs and laughed at them?

You are lying.

Wrestling is real. We should get riled up.

Gosh, next thing you will be telling me is that Republican elected officials are actually friends with Democrat elected officials.

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 03:14 PM
86. To these Rejects Wresting is real. And that is why they would fight so hard against something THEY THEMSELVES will ultimately put in place.

Obamacare may be Romneycare but for them that makes all the difference.

Republicans want to do to health care what they did to affirmative action (Nixon signed it) what they did to the Americans With Disabilities Act(that was Bush I) what they did to the bailouts (Bush destroyed capitalism to save it).

Because if there is any socializing of America to do it then Damn Gum It hasn't the Republican party proven that they are the best able to do it!

Let's Defeat Obamacare so we can enact Romneycare. You say they are the same thing, well, in a way but actually no because we call it Romneycare instead of Obamacare so that makes all the difference.

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 03:41 PM
87. These Repug rejects on Sound Politics are all Wrestling fans who don't realize that their "heroes" go out with their enemies after the show and LAUGH AT YOU!

And you deserve to be laughed at for the suckers you are.

Ben, you are right. In the end we will have Socialized Medicine and right now it's even month whether it will be the Republicans or the Democrats who will give it to us. So what this is all about is putting on a show for funraising purposes. Since we will have Socialized Medicine regardless, they are getting the country riled up for nothing. Well nothing but their coffers that is.

When you see all the heat that the Republicans are putting on this you can just imagine Michael Steele going "k-ching".

Frankly if we are going to have this anyway I rather it be called Obamacare than Romneycare. Repugs. are already burdened with the historical reality that it was they, not the Democrats but they who "destroyed capitalism to save it".

Posted by: Beth on August 26, 2009 03:50 PM
88. Let's all remember.

Socialized Medicine is bad.

Bad, bad, bad.

Until a Republican proposes it.

Then it is good.

Good, good, good.

Oh, and of course never doubt for a minute that Wrestling is real. They really do despise each other. Ben is a liar.

Posted by: Dave on August 26, 2009 03:55 PM