I, for one, am grateful for the plumbers who have fixed things in my home. And, yes, judging from their well-deserved invoices, I can imagine there are quite a few plumbers who make $250K or more a year.
Posted by Stefan Sharkansky at October 16, 2008 08:07 PM | Email ThisTell us Sharky, We really want to know.
Posted by: Unkl Witz on October 16, 2008 08:08 PM
And thanks for bringing this up.
Hey shark... time for you to get you head out of your rump and get real about the financial wherewhithall of those of us who aren't on the right wing payolla machine.
Some of us have to actually work for a living, not just mouth off about folks you don't like.
Posted by: Unkl Witz on October 16, 2008 08:18 PMHow did that Clinton tax cut work out for you? You know, the one he promised in 1992, only instead of delivering, he signed the biggest tax increase in history.
I never heard Obama talk about a tax cut until a couple of months ago. Apparently some strategist sat him down and said, "Look fella, do what you want after you are elected, but unless you tell 'em you're giving 'em a tax cut, you'll never get elected."
Three words about Obama's tax cut:
Never. Gonna. Happen.
Posted by: deedub on October 16, 2008 08:37 PMMaybe Joe won't be in that over 250K income yet, BUT his suppliers will be, the manufacturers of those supplies will be, the suppliers of the raw materials for those manufacturers will be and the transportation companies for the suppliers, the manufacturers, the suppliers of raw materials will be. Think Atlas Shrugged and the Twentieth Century Motor Company.
The really fun part will be when Joe the plumber realizes that it's actually more beneficial for him to be a failure. That, instead of "[putting] his blood and sweat into his work," he can get the same result by being, as Obambi so eloquently puts it: "the guy behind him."
"THAT WON'T HAPPEN!!!!!" shriek you socialists. Yes, it will. Given the choice between working and not working, and getting the same result either way - needs met, bills (say, health care) paid for, education, subsidized housing, public transportation - which do you think a person is going to pick? Work, or not work?
Obama wants to raise taxes on those making $250,000 a year and more.
Oh, that's just great. So, instead of crippling the plumber personally, you'll cripple everyone he relies on for his trade. You'll tax the trade masters and educators who teach him his trade. You'll tax the publishers who print and distribute the materials he relies on to learn (and continue learning) how to do his job. You'll tax the manufacturer of the parts he needs to buy in order to do his job. You'll tax the retailer who sells the parts that allow him to quickly and efficiently do his job. And after a year or so of that, you know what'll happen?
All those people will move offshore. And why shouldn't they? You're de facto punishing them for their success. And soon enough, you won't HAVE any $250K+ people to tax. So what will you do? Lower the ceiling. Rinse and repeat.
And how long until the plumber is the ceiling? Well, nevermind - we don't really have to worry about that. We'll have suffered complete economic collapse by that point.
Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold on October 16, 2008 08:39 PM
...Unless it's your brother apparently
George Obama is the Chi-town Assclown's half brother living in Nairobi, Kenya in a 6'x10' hut and "reports to get by on a dollar a month". If The Obama's (who made $4 Million dollars last year) can ignore their own flesh and blood, what gives the average American any indication that he gives a damn about them and their families financial situation? Bottom line: He doesn't
So far, everyday folks that didn't make 4Bills last year have helped George Obama a thousand times more than his own disgrace of a half brother through contributions to sites set up on the internet...including D'souza and tc's favorite guy Sean Hannity.
tc: Feel free to chime in on whether this blatant hypocrisy on Obama's part is acceptable to a "christian" such as yourself and other Obamaphiles.
Posted by: Rick D. on October 16, 2008 08:58 PMThere's nothing honorable about forcing money out of people who earned it, and then turning around and giving it to people who didn't. Many people--including the small business-owners Obama wants to punish, and who didn't earn last year what Obama earned-- give 10%+ of their income to church/non-profits. Obama gave only 6/10 of one percent of his income to such last year--on a $4 million+ income. 6/10 of ONE percent. Maybe HE needs to redistribute HIS wealth first, before brazenly talking about doing that to others?
Posted by: Michele on October 16, 2008 09:51 PMI'd like to see McCain and Palin give access to the public like Obama does. I won't hold my breath.
Can you imagine McCain running our country as poorly as he has ran this (ten year long) presidential campaign? He even had to kiss Bush's ass, after what Rove did to his family, in South Carolina. How pathetic. How sad. The dues ya gotta pay...
Now are we ready for the Republicon robo calls? Wahooo!!!!
Ring: Computer says: "Did you know Barack Obama....blah, blah, blah" Sickening.
I can't wait till the deadly disease, which is today's Republiconvict Party is disinfected from our country. Fear, hate and greed. Their whole sick pathetic platform.
What I love most is how (Republiconvicts) they are gonna do all they can to keep Barack from doing what needs to be done to fix what is wrong with America. After all the damage Reaganomics, and conservative (not really) trickle "UP" policies have done to weaken, and bankrupt her. It is sad..... So sad....
History will not treat them kindly, as it shouldn't.
Maybe Joe the Liar should run McCain's campaign from here on out. Couldn't hurt.....
Posted by: All Facts Support My Positions on October 16, 2008 10:34 PMYou think they may have wanted to vet this Steve dude? Think maybe?
Are you sure McCain didn't ditch his plane on purpose, and beg the North Vietnamese to take him in? I'm just sayin....
Posted by: All Facts Support My Positions on October 16, 2008 10:41 PMSo, lemme get this straight. You are asking us to believe that the McCain campaign knew that Barry was going to walk down that street at that exact moment, and thus planted Joe there to ask the question?
Who is delusional?
Posted by: Dave on October 16, 2008 11:57 PM'Joe' neverclaimed that he MADE $250K a year, but that he was thinking of PURCHASING a company that would make that amount.
He asked an honest question and Obama gave a very honest answer, for once. "I want to spread around the wealth," Right out of Karl Marx.
For that, he is tasting the Thugocracy of Obamessiah's surrogates.
I guess questioning 'The One' is out of the question.
What next, Krystalnacht II?
Posted by: Lew Waters on October 17, 2008 12:47 AMOh, and Facts, if you're going to make fun of Joe for not using his first name (just like millions of other people in this country), you should at least try to get his first name right. Otherwise you look stupid as well as petty.
But maybe you're used to it.
Posted by: Paula on October 17, 2008 06:49 AMThe audacity of aspiring to succeed! Take that, Joe!
Posted by: Paula on October 17, 2008 07:05 AMI'm old enough to remember way back when. But it also qualifies me to remember the Carter and forecast the upcoming Obama years.
Isn't it just like the left to villify a joe schmoe who got thrust into the limelight without intent? Give the guy his 15 minutes and move on. This baloney your guys are coming up with are despicable and disgusting. Give the poor guy a break.
I have had several of my employees who were not licensed or certified or whatever refer to themselves as the licensed name. It is just easier and it describes what they are doing with their job. I would think a 'plumber' pretty well describes what the guy does. Why are you having such a heartburn? I just don't get it, unlike Barry, who will be getting my wallet.
Bruce, seeing the union goons in Ohio and unnamed staffers (who probably don't know the law) go after this guy was very sickening. Look what your side has gotten yourself down to.
Since you brought up tax liens as being anti-American, why don't you go after Barry's treasurer who also has tax liens. The thing about him is that he is accepting illegal contributions from the likes of GoodWill and Good Night. Seems more serious to me.
As for tax liens in general, sometimes people fall upon hard times. I'll save my anecdotes of friends who have gotten in trouble and why for a later segment.
Posted by: swatter on October 17, 2008 07:23 AMCompany Profile: A W Newell Corporation
Year Started:1974
State of Incorporation:OH
URL:N/A
Location Type:Single Location
Stock Symbol:N/A
Stock Exchange:N/A
Also Does Business As:Newell A W Plumbing & Heating
NAICS:N/A
SIC #Code: View Details
Est. Annual Sales: $510,000
Est. Employees:8
Est. Employees at Location:8
Contact Name:Alan W Newell
Contact Title:President & Treasurer
Maybe someone can help UWitz with the math.
Posted by: SouthernRoots on October 17, 2008 07:33 AMA few cities have their own licensing procedures, so maybe where Joe lives he doesn't need one.
Jack Van Nostrand
A few cities have their own licensing procedures, so maybe where Joe lives he doesn't need one.
Jack Van Nostrand
Jack Van Nostrand
Joe the Plumber has had his entire life made bare (and trashed) in less than 24 hours by the MSM... and yet in almost 2 years no one in MSM has asked the same in depth questions of Obambi.
Knoxville's Joe the Plumber doubts Obama, too
Joe the Plumber, of Knoxville, that is, says he's less concerned about whether he gets a tax break if his customers still can't afford to hire him.Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold on October 17, 2008 09:14 AM
If EITHER Joe the plumber, makes $249,000, pays 36% in taxes ($89,640) and ends up net 159,360, why would he want to work harder to make 250,000, pay 39% in taxes (97,500) and only NET 152,500?
If Joe is smart he'll work only up to the edge of the figure that raises his taxes.
No, most plumbers don't make that. But I bet most plumbers who move up to owning their own plumbing business, do. When you decrease the entrepreneurship incentive by raising taxes, less people will do it, and less jobs will be created.
Posted by: Palouse on October 17, 2008 09:26 AMHow about the NY senator who has tax problems..
Plus he helps to write the tax law! LOL
But don't tell the dem's
Posted by: Army Medic/Vet on October 17, 2008 09:30 AMWhether Joe the Plumber is a Republican or a Democrat, a decided or undecided registered or unregistered voter, gay or straight, a wearer of boxers or briefs, a huge GOP donor or even the secret love child of John McCain doesn't matter, because it doesn't change what Barack Obama said. Of his own free will, Obama admitted that he believes his tax plan is a good thing because when you "spread the wealth around" it's good for everybody.Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold on October 17, 2008 09:49 AMThose of us who have believed Obama's policy proposals to be a socialist redistribution of wealth had everything we believed confirmed, straight from the horse's mouth. That is what was so shocking about the video exchange between Obama and Wurzelbacher -- what Obama said.
Obama told Joe that it is okay to soak those making more than $250,000 because then you can "spread the wealth" around and everyone will benefit. That is redistribution of wealth - taking from the rich (and from the kinda rich) and giving to the not so rich and the poor. And Obama admitted it. Out loud. On video....
...a Gallup poll from June: "When given a choice about how government should address the numerous economic difficulties facing today's consumer, Americans overwhelmingly - by 84% to 13% -- prefer that the government focus on improving overall economic conditions and the jobs situation in the United States as opposed to taking steps to distribute wealth more evenly among Americans."
It is the same way here in Oregon. I had one year as an apprentice up in Hermiston.
Jack Van Nostrand
Keep it up children. Keep on mocking the working man and by god I'll vote McCain!
Posted by: Democrat on October 17, 2008 10:10 AMThe issue is NOT who Joe the Plumber is, what is tax situation is, his employment situation, or his political affiliation. The issue is Barry's ANSWER!!!!!. When left without a teleprompter to remind him of his talking points, we hear the true Barry. He's a Marxist. He so much as admitted it. THAT is the story!!!! Hell, a 7th grader could have asked Barry the same question. Would the Obamathugs then start an exhaustive investigation on him?
What is very telling is that NO ONE in the MSM is questioning Barry about his true colors now being shown. THAT's where the focus should be.
"Uh, excuse me, Senator but where does the Constitution give the Federal Government the power to rob from the rich and give to the poor? Can you please cite the Article that gives either the President or Congress that power? What's that? You don't know? You're running for President and if you win you will swear to preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of the United States. One would think that you would be familiar with such document and be able to recite the specific powers of your job and Congress. So, let me ask you again Senator: Where does the Constitution grant either the President or Congress the power to do what you are wanting to do?" BZZZZZZZ! No. Sorry. It's not the General Welfare clause. Still your board. Would you care to try "How a Bill becomes Law" for @200?
Posted by: Dave on October 17, 2008 10:13 AMJoe never said he made 250.000 he wants to...
Plus you don't have to have a lic to be a plummer, just as the Boeing Mech's don't have to have a A&P lic to work on planes, because Boeing holds the lic.
Gezzz come up to speed would ya!
Posted by: Army Medic/Vet on October 17, 2008 10:37 AMBut I think what I should say now is "God help you Joe." Look, 16 plus years ago I was where you are now. And I must tell you if Obama wins, I am pulling the plug in a few months. I am out. I have had it. I am preparing to destroy almost 100 jobs and lower my tax bracket and I can't wait.Consider: 16 years ago I was statistically in poverty, but I had dreams and a plan. At the time, the remnants of Reaganomics still set the economic tone and a fired up Newt Gingrich was forcing conservatism on the Clinton White House every time Bill and Hillary tried to move left. There were actually politicians who praised business owners and business in general. Against that backdrop, I've had a pretty good run. It's been extremely challenging and the move up was not a straight line, but I am better off than I was 16 years ago. And 8 years ago. And 4 years ago. And so are a lot of folks who have been on this ride with me.
But Joe, I am not better off than I was just 2 years ago. That's when decades of liberal energy policy came home to roost and four dollar gas took several hundred thousands from my bottom line faster than I could possibly react. That same gas price slammed my customers -- and my customer's customers -- forcing our company into a vice of rapidly rising costs and rapidly dropping revenues. Oh, and for fun, slower payments from our customers.
Atlas's shoulders are getting tired and Galt's Gulch is going to get crowded.
As for me, I have had enough. I have fought creeping liberalism and managed more wins than losses over 17 years. We have progressed to where our business, now a corporation, is big enough so that Obama and his ilk now have their own ideas about "what larger businesses can afford" and what "corporations can afford."Well I've got news for him. I cannot afford what they think I can afford, so I am breaking her up and giving her away to some key employees. I wish them well too. They are like you, tough and smart. Perhaps if they stay small enough and never can carry forward more than 250 thou to the next year, they will be allowed to keep their businesses through a downturn.
BINGO! Perhaps if they stay small enough and never can carry forward more than 250 thou to the next year
Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold on October 17, 2008 10:45 AMThe tax thing clouds this. But it revealed how O-blah-blah thinks..."spreading the wealth". ON WHAT BASIS? Isn't Joe capable of "spreading" his own wealth?
McCain is sooooooooo weak. I think he has run out of steam ala Bob Dole. McCain wanted to run for President for years....and he is limping badly. He keeps missing opportunities like this to make real points.
It's frustrating to watch McCain continually let O-blah-blah off the hook on so many issues....and miss opportunities to be the Clear Candidate of the JOB-CREATORS!!
Posted by: Mr. Cynical on October 17, 2008 10:58 AMPlease elaborate, how does a minimal tax increase for one quintile of households equate with socialism? Especially one that is well within the norms of the last 28 years?
Please also explain how the current Republican philosophy of low taxes and high deficit spending is not socialization of debt by spreading the burden around "equally" among households.
For fun: http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/taxes.asp
"In a higher phase of communist society, after the enslaving subordination of the individual to the division of labor, and therewith also the antithesis between mental and physical labor, has vanished; after labor has become not only a means of life but life's prime want; after the productive forces have also increased with the all-around development of the individual, and all the springs of co-operative wealth flow more abundantly--only then can the narrow horizon of bourgeois right be crossed in its entirety and society inscribe on its banners: From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs."
From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs.
Thanks so much for confirming it AGAIN.
Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold on October 17, 2008 11:18 AMI suspect it's because Joe makes something like 40k a year, doesn't own the business, doesn't have a license, and owes $1200 in back taxes. Heck, Joe could have been stricken from the voter rolls in Ohio due to bad handwriting (they had Worzelbacher registered vs. the proper spelling Wurzelbacher).
Joe the Plumber has had his entire life made bare (and trashed) in less than 24 hours by the MSM
Joe was doing just fine till McCain started using him as a prop. He asked a tough question, no one has a problem with that. Speaking you mind and asking tough questions is patriotic. I'm glad he asked his question. Seems rather disingenuous of you to start rally against the MSM for doing their job.
Joe became a national interest when his name came up 23 times in a debate between two people, one of which will be leading the free world come January. I can't think of a better way to become a person of interest in America. Now that Joe is famous people want to know more about Joe, who is he, what's his story? Joe become a campaign prop through no fault of his own. The media did what McCain should have done before using Joe as a prop, vetted him.
McCain made Joe into the average Joe....too bad Joe doesn't like paying his taxes or getting a proper license for the job he's doing. I have no doubt he's a hard working guy, but like that "overhead projector" in the Planetarium that McCain kept tossing about, it sounded good in the debate but the facts didn't sync up with the reality. Once again John McCain played loose with the facts, and Conservative are forced to pivot and defend Joe could have cared less about 10 days ago.
McCain now has to go out and explain the public how Joe will not benefit under his plan and not Obama's when every economist in the country seems to agree that Joe would be better off under Obama's plan. This never would have happened if the McCain staff had done their homework.
I don't feel sorry for Joe, I'm sure some GOP donor will be happy to pay Joe's back taxes, settle his divorce for him, and give him a show on Fox if that's what it would take to defeat Obama. He's going to be making bank this weekend doing the talk show circuit in NYC this weekend. Heck he's even got his own Wikipedia entry now. Good for Joe asking the tough questions, shame on McCain's staff for not properly vetting the "facts" (much like McCain didn't properly vet his power-abusing VP who's afraid of answering the tough questions...let Palin face O'Riley or Chris Mathews, Obama's done it).
The entire QUOTE is:
Joe the Plumber has had his entire life made bare (and trashed) in less than 24 hours by the MSM... and yet in almost 2 years no one in MSM has asked the same in depth questions of Obambi.
Now gee obfusCATOr, what was the main point of that quote... you know the part you conveniently obfuscate so well?
yet in almost 2 years no one in MSM has asked the same in depth questions of Obambi.
Answer the question, obfusCATOr the COWARD.
Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold on October 17, 2008 11:27 AMPlease. 60% of the taxes in the US are paid by the richest. 40% don't even pay.
So there is NO-WAY to give 95% of taxpayers a break.
I guess both you and Obama failed simple math.
Posted by: Army Medic/Vet on October 17, 2008 12:22 PMNot my words, his.
and as much as I couldn't stand Bush's spending. Obama's is far worse.
But I still say as I have said before. If Obama get's in and does what he has said. Look for the Rep's to take over congress in the next two years. Just Like Clinton when he raised taxes and went on a spending spree.
Posted by: Army Medic/Vet on October 17, 2008 12:38 PMYou're leaving out the other side of the equation. You know, where his plan actually distributes that money to people who don't pay taxes, which he cleverly disguises as "tax credits". He's proposed alot of them, $500 "make work" credit, $4,000 tuition credit, $7,000 "clean" vehicle credit. There's more too.
What he doesn't advertise is that you're eligible for them even if you don't have a tax liability. It's a check from the taxpayers to the non-taxpayers.
THAT is socialism.
Posted by: Palouse on October 17, 2008 12:40 PMObambi explained: "spread the wealth around".
Obama told Joe that it is okay to soak those making more than $250,000 because then you can "spread the wealth" around and everyone will benefit. That is redistribution of wealth - taking from the rich (and from the kinda rich) and giving to the not so rich and the poor. And Obama admitted it. Out loud. On video....Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold on October 17, 2008 12:44 PM
Joe the plumber is in trouble. He has committed an unspeakable act - he spoke up for capitalism and free enterprise. He publicly spoke taboo words: "I don't want to be taxed more just because I work harder." But it gets even worse. His words have put the Messiah from Illinois, Barack Obama, on the defensive. There is only one solution: Joe must be destroyed. (With the media fixated on Joe, maybe Sarah Palin will get a break!)The same media that have done nothing to investigate Weather Underground terrorist William Ayers, the same media that have ignored the relationship between Ayers and Obama, the same big shot reporters who have turned Michelle Obama into a mystery woman whose views are "off limits," and the same media that left no stone unturned in Alaska trying to embarrass Sarah Palin - that media are now in a feeding frenzy to destroy Blue Collar Joe. And the Obama/Biden campaign is piling on, too.
In the last 24-hours the inquiring minds of the press have discovered that Joe once had a tax lien against him for $1,200. Several press outlets charged that he wasn't even registered to vote. Then they dropped that attack and replaced it with an even more damaging charge: He is registered, but - GASP! - "He's a Republican!"
Diane Sawyer wanted to know whether the McCain campaign had talked to Joe before he confronted Obama The Savior. (No, it had not.) Then this news broke last night - he isn't really a plumber because he didn't finish the Ohio licensing requirements. Before the day is over, we will know whether he ever said a cross word, had too much to drink or passed gas.
The goal is clear: Destroy Joe before Americans wake up to the fact that they are close to electing the most far left, pro-abortion, anti-military, socialism-advocating candidate in the history of the United States.
Pray for Joe, his family and his friends. Unless he recants and pledges allegiance to Obama in the next few days, Joe is toast.
The same media that have done nothing to investigate Weather Underground terrorist William Ayers, the same media that have ignored the relationship between Ayers and Obama, the same big shot reporters who have turned Michelle Obama into a mystery woman whose views are "off limits,"
Go to the next thread up and see what I wrote.
ACORN again... but worse.
Posted by: Army Medic/Vet on October 17, 2008 12:58 PMSo what is socialism? Is it 36.5% 39%? 15%? 91%? Do you know?
I have found no greater satisfaction than achieving success through honest dealing and strict adherence to the view that, for you to gain, those you deal with should gain as well. -Alan Greenspan
FALSE. Please list all of the TAX CREDITS that you can get if you don't pay any taxes on your income tax return. What you don't seem to understand, or you chose to ignore, is that you don't even have to work to get those Obama tax credits I listed above. Think about that. It's socialism.
Posted by: Palouse on October 17, 2008 01:18 PMJust stop trying to be clever and disingenuous. Your coy ignorance of the facts is getting toresome and disgusting.
Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold on October 17, 2008 01:26 PMAnd there my friends is PROOF of the tiresome dishonesty, PROOF that he does understand socialism.
Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold on October 17, 2008 01:28 PMYes, but you have to pay taxes. Under Obama's plan, you don't. THAT is what's fundamentally different. HE IS GIVING MONEY TO PEOPLE WHO DON'T PAY TAXES. Do you not understand this?
Posted by: Palouse on October 17, 2008 01:30 PMIt's simple. One candidate (McCain) gives you tax credits that reduce your tax liability. No tax liability, no credits.
The other (Obama) gives you tax credits even if you have no tax liability. This is socialism, or welfare, take your pick.
Posted by: Palouse on October 17, 2008 01:36 PM
But he can't understand that.
If acid & cato thinks socialism is so good. Try France and walk the neighborhoods where the poor who live off of gov money only. Just don't bring your car or it could be torched.
The people of the state of Alaska OWN the resources of Alaska. Like investors who OWN shares of a company, they share in the profits from them. The money they get is not being REDISTRIBUTED from anyone.
Nice try.
Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold on October 17, 2008 01:46 PMOn the other hand, you have not disproved Obambi's socialsm.
You, following in the footsteps of your comrade demo-kid, would prefer to emulate mizaru, kikazaru, iwazaru.
Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold on October 17, 2008 01:55 PMAre the armed services socialist?
He's arguing for something he doesn't even begin to understand.
Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold on October 17, 2008 01:58 PMI have explained it, in clear terms, how Obama's plan is socialism. The fact that you don't seem to understand that it is, is depressing.
Posted by: Palouse on October 17, 2008 02:00 PMWhat in the hell are you talking about? You may wish to read up on our founding fathers. Remember taxes was the one of reasons we fought back against England.
By the way. The Armed services are a dictatorship.
Your ruled by the upper ranks unless they break the rules in our constution.
I take it you've never done that, or you would not have ask that question.
Posted by: Army Medic/Vet on October 17, 2008 02:06 PM"lobster hors d'oeuvres, two whole steamed lobsters, Iranian caviar and champagne"
What would all those Joe the plumbers think?, comrade.
And don't we have some kind embargo with Iran... or at least a 'pre-condition' to their exports??
Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold on October 17, 2008 02:24 PMI suspect it's because Joe makes something like 40k a year, doesn't own the business, doesn't have a license, and owes $1200 in back taxes. Heck, Joe could have been stricken from the voter rolls in Ohio due to bad handwriting (they had Worzelbacher registered vs. the proper spelling Wurzelbacher)."
How does your suspicion relate to my comment? Just curious as I didn't even mention Joe, I was talking about my neighbor.
Beyond that, Joe didn't actually say how much he was currently making; he gave a ballpark figure of how much the business that currently employs him is making. Joe didn't actually say he owned the business; he said he wanted to buy it. Joe doesn't need a license if he works for a licensed master plumber. You have no way of knowing if Joe does, indeed, have bad handwriting or if the data entry operator entering his registration made a typo. Joe does, however, owe back taxes. So I guess 1 out of 5 isn't bad. I'll keep that 1 to 5 ratio in mind when evaluating your future posts.
Posted by: Paula on October 17, 2008 02:56 PMThe top 10 percent owns 71% of the wealth.
http://sociology.ucsc.edu/whorulesamerica/power/wealth.html
Posted by: Just asking on October 17, 2008 04:45 PMSo what?
Wealth is NOT a zero sum game. If you want to be in that top 10%, the top 20%, the top 40% get your ass up and go work for it.
Just because I have 2 popsicles on a hot day does not mean you are entitled to one of them.
Freeze your own damned Koolaid.
Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold on October 17, 2008 04:53 PMNo, Joe does not own a business right now. What difference does that make? Is America no longer the place of dreams and goals?
Joe owes back taxes? So what! So does Charlie Rangel, Democrat Congressman!
Does any of that mean Joe is no longer entitled to the free speech that allows him to voice his opinion?
According to the trash mongers in the the MSM and the Obambi campaign it does.
Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold on October 17, 2008 04:59 PMIf EITHER Joe the plumber, makes $249,000, pays 36% in taxes ($89,640) and ends up net 159,360, why would he want to work harder to make 250,000, pay 39% in taxes (97,500) and only NET 152,500?
If Joe is smart he'll work only up to the edge of the figure that raises his taxes."
The 3% increase in taxes is only on the profits earned above $250,000. So if Joe makes $251,000 instead of $250,000 Joe would pay an additional $30 in taxes. If Joe is smart, he'll be making as much as he can as he will still be keeping $610 for every $1000 earned.
For details: http://economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/10/16/tax-advice-for-joe-the-plumber/
Posted by: Just asking on October 17, 2008 05:01 PM$251,000 @ 39% = $97,890 = $153,130 Net
Why would anyone work for that extra 2K just to take home $6,230 LESS.
You go right ahead and do so.
I'm stopping BEFORE Senator Government and SanFranGranNan take more.... especially since that $6230 would just about cover my current King County pproperty tax
Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold on October 17, 2008 05:09 PMhttp://www.huffingtonpost.com/jane-devin/many-us-corporations-not_b_135104.html
Posted by: Just asking on October 17, 2008 05:15 PMI'm impressed, to say the least.
Posted by: JDH on October 17, 2008 05:20 PM$251,000 = ($250,000 @ 36% = $90,000 = $160,000 Net) plus ($1,000 @ $39% = $390 = $610 Net) = $90,390 = $160,610 Net
Posted by: Just asking on October 17, 2008 05:25 PMFalse. I've given you the example, several times.
Current system - no tax credit if you have no tax liability
Obama system - tax credits (welfare) for people who don't pay taxes and have no tax liability.
Posted by: Palouse on October 17, 2008 05:30 PMSpeaking of ties to leftist radicals
Posted by: Ragnar Danneskjold on October 17, 2008 09:47 PMAccording to the Brookings Institution/Urban Institute's Tax Policy Center, in TODAY's tax code, the marginal rate for a family of 4, child in college, and one receiving after school day-care earning between $25K and $45K is 20%. Under Barry's plan that rate fluctuates upwards as your income increases from $25K to $45K. If you make $25K you are at 20@. But then it starts to go up. From 25K to 35K it rises to a top level of 33%. If you are between $35K and less than $45K your rate can be as high at 40%
With today's code, you marginal tax rate is 0% at $45K, then rises to %15 at around $50K. At $70K it dips down to about %13 and stays there until around $100K
Under Barry's plan, you don't get 0% at $45K. Your patriotic duty comes in at about %18. (In fact, at $40K your marginal tax rate is %39!!!!. So when you move from 25K, make sure your boss gives you a raise at to 45K not 40K. Otherwise you have little incentive to work.) It stays at %18 until just over $50K where it dips to %16 (still higher than today). You don't reach parity to today unil $85K.
Now this is where it starts to get really fun! Today you go to rise from %23 to 30% at $105K. When you hit $110 you jump to 33%. At $115K - $125K you dip down around %28.
Under Barry's plan you really get to go to town.! Under his plan you go from %23 to about %42 at $105K. Then you go even HIGHER as you move from $!10K to $120K, topping out at around %45!!. You then reach parity at %28 at the same income as today.
So, about that "middle class tax cut", again? Well, as you can see..not there. This is Barry's voodoo economics that pays for his welfare...er.. I mean, tax credit checks to those that pay NO INCOME TAX! Without going into boring details, this is the effect of Barry phasing out or lowering some of today's current tax credits, PLUS phasing out his PROPOSED plethora of welfare..er I mean, tax credits as you make more money. PLUS (nope, not done yet!) it includes Barry's plan to increase Medicare and SS taxes for this income bracket.
Whenever you hear a politician promise to lower taxes, you better hope he's talking about MARGINAL tax rates. (Like Reagan did). Otherwise, you likely ain't gettin' squat. And may likely have to pay more.
So, I don't see how Barry is going to motivate the middle class to earn more money.
Posted by: Dave on October 17, 2008 11:31 PMThe above post by Stefan the Meteorologist and the subsequent post might serve as excellent evidence for the sheer stupidity, gullibility, and greed-inspired foolishness of conservatives.
Hey ... how many of you make more than $250,000 a year?
Now I know that it is impossible to educate the terminally stupid conservative bottom-feeders ... but it doesn't really matter. Obama will become president and you people are going to have to cry over losing a tax cut which cannot possibly benefit you in the least.
Did you hear what Bill Maher said about you people? Conservatives live in a greed-motivated fantasyland. All of you really do believe that you are going to be making the big money some day and this is the reason why you work so very hard to protect the selfish interests of the rich.
When will Joe get his plumbing license, pay is back taxes and start earning more than $50,000 a year?
Posted by: David Mathews on October 18, 2008 12:37 PMTrying to discredit "Joe" does nothing to take away from what Barry said: "spread the wealth around". So now that we finally set an honest answer from Barry the issue is: are you comfortable voting for a Marxist? That should McCain's "are you better off today...." Reagan-esque question.
Posted by: Dave on October 18, 2008 07:46 PMTrying to discredit "Joe" does nothing to take away from what Barry said: "spread the wealth around". So now that we finally set an honest answer from Barry the issue is: are you comfortable voting for a Marxist? That should McCain's "are you better off today...." Reagan-esque question.
Posted by: Dave on October 18, 2008 07:48 PMTrying to discredit "Joe" does nothing to take away from what Barry said: "spread the wealth around". So now that we finally set an honest answer from Barry the issue is: are you comfortable voting for a Marxist? That should McCain's "are you better off today...." Reagan-esque question.
Posted by: Dave on October 18, 2008 07:50 PMTrying to discredit "Joe" does nothing to take away from what Barry said: "spread the wealth around". So now that we finally set an honest answer from Barry the issue is: are you comfortable voting for a Marxist? That should McCain's "are you better off today...." Reagan-esque question.
Posted by: Dave on October 18, 2008 07:51 PMJoe's background is COMPLETELY irrelevant to the issue
Eh ... yeah. I've got a bridge up in Alaska to sell you, Dave!
what Barry said: "spread the wealth around". So now that we finally set an honest answer from Barry the issue is: are you comfortable voting for a Marxist?
A majority of Americans are comfortable voting for Barack Obama. Senator Senile and Governor Moose-Killer are going to lose, yep yep!
Posted by: David Mathews on October 19, 2008 04:41 AMCamile, #3 "Just a guess-Any plumber who runs his own business, hires one or two others to help in his business, needs to keep a pricey inventory to support his jobs, and files an individual tax return for that business?"
Yes..he may have $250k in REVENUE..but that is NOT what gets taxes. Income (Revenue - expenses) gets taxed. His inventory does NOT get taxed. He only gets taxed on his income, AFTER his business expenses. Good luck finding a plumber who makes $250k TAXABLE income.
PC & Ragnar. Either you guys are clueless, or deliberately lying to try and make your point. #93 is indeed correct. You do NOT pay the higher tax rate on all your income..just on the small portion above $250k. Have you guys ever filled out a tax return? I really wonder sometimes..this stuff isn't exactly rocket science. If Joe the plumber were to earn an extra $1k over $250k, he'd owe an additional $30 under Obama. A crushing burden..LOL. Not that a plumber is going to earn $250k in taxable profits anytime soon...
Posted by: Proteus on October 21, 2008 07:21 AM.jpg){kind=link}
