September 03, 2008
Machinists Vote To Strike
That's the "breaking news" locally. Supposedly the union is giving Boeing a 48 hour window of extra negotiations to avoid a strike.
Prediction: the final offer from Boeing will drop including the Machinists in the company's incentive plan in return for slightly higher offers in base pay and pensions, plus more significant lump sum bonuses upon ratification. This will mirror that last round of negotiations three years ago where the Machinists likewise bargained their way out of the annual incentive pay plan partaken of by white collar employees and SPEEA members.
Then three years from now, Machinist spokespeople will once again lament the mothers in management screwing them out of incentive pay. Well, that and wonder why Boeing keeps farming out work to partners rather than pay more people under the contract they won while Boeing was under the gun trying to get the 787 production line rolling.
Meaning: the Machinists will get the "job security" they want for their workforce, heavy on older employees. Then as Machinists retire and a dwindling number are left, Boeing will continue to work with outside partners (or move production to right-to-work states).
But the old guys sitting on their Machinist pensions will be happy with themselves...
UPDATE: headline fixed.
Posted by Eric Earling at September 03, 2008
10:21 PM | Email This
1. This is how US Steel crumbled and how the auto industry is dying. I have no doubt Boeing will die a slow death. Pensions are no good when the company is gone. Ask the employees of Pan Am.
2. Well, they called those of us warning them against a strike "morons". We'll see who the morons are.
3. Outsource 'em. The USA is not about guarantees.
4.
It makes good business sense. Seattle is no longer affordable for working people. They need a good sized raise to feed themselves here.
Alternatively, Boeing should pick up and leave for McDonald Douglas' old turf.
Then Duwamish can become a park and residential area again...
5. Once McDermott gets the Duwamish Tribe regognized and Gregoire get her cut, the tribe can take over the whole waterway when Boeing and all of the Concrete Plants and the Steel Mill are closed or move. Heck you will probably get the opportunity to invest in a Superfund clean-up before they take over too!
6. john B
Alternatively, Boeing should pick up and leave for McDonald Douglas' old turf.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The Taxes in CALIF are far worse than this state.
Boeing would really take a hit being down there.
7. I think the 48 hour period "negotiated" by Gregoire is a political ploy. Her union supporters know she needs some positive press, so now when the machinists accept the next offer, Gregoire will launch a series of ads touting her leadership on this issue.
8. where's chrissy on the illegal teacher's strike??
9. where's chrissy on the illegal teacher's strike??
10. There is nothing Dumber and more Lazy than a Strong Union member and supporter. They run around thinking the World owes them a living and love any opportunity to Spit in the face of their employers. During their workday, they will do as little as possible to get through the day. Their productivity is always at the low end for the compensations of their receiving wage. They will conduct themselves in a irresponsible manner and will use any opportunity to bleed the company of its resources. Eventually, if circumstances allow, they will cripple or destroy the goose that lays the golden egg for them. After all, they are Liberals at their finest.
11. Does anyone believe that the 'last minute' call from the queen to convince the union to give it another 48 hours wasn't totally staged?
Admittedly, she can't afford the loss of state revenue the striking workers would cost. That could cost at least as much as her tax collectors have retrieved from the drivers on I5 and I405 recently.
12. Nice to know that the Governor has the "pull" to call Union Leadership and postpone a strike called by the members. If the members honor the delay they are nothing but puppets. Of course the Bellevue teachers have more guts than the IAM Leadership. Or maybe Gregoire is just more interested in the Boeing Union than the Parents in the Bellevue School District. I hear on the radio that Gregoire is now a part of the negotiations with the mediator the Union and Boeing. This is a private company in negotiations with a private union, who is paying the bill for her time? Her staffs time? Are taxpayers or is she buying vacation time to act on this private matter with the donations she has recieved from the union?
13. Ok, but let's not "tar & feather" all of the IAM members.
I bet many didn't want to strike, but others did.
Also anyone who joins Boeing planes builders must join the IAM.
14. Farming out the parts led to further farming out the parts by the people who were supposed to be building them. Those sub-sub-contracts failed to produce the parts to Boeing's specs and the project got
bogged down and delayed. Boeing had to spend extra time and money trying to hold it's partners accountable for something they passed on to somone else who said would do it cheaper (and failed to live up to their claims).
Just imagine how much it costs to fly the Dreamlifter from back and forth from Japan and Italy with current fuel prices. Boeing would have been better off building it off-site and closer to home. Boeing would have saved a ton of money, time, and grief not to mention giving jobs to thousands of Washington State residents.
15. Cato - unfortunately, the largest carbon fiber manufacturers are in Japan. There are none in the Northwest region.
16. Cato @14......Farming out parts is necessary for expediency, production cost and political considerations. You don't expect an Aircraft Manufacturer to build all components such as Seats and Lavatories do you? Just, as you wouldn't expect a Home Builder to build the plumbing, sinks and toilets to complete the house either. Yes, there are some major Aircraft components being built outside the Country but, with perhaps, less labor cost, these structures even, with the cost of shipment may even be cheaper. There is also the Political considerations of sharing the Wealth and Expertise with other Countries which smooths the way for the acceptance and the purchase of said Aircraft throughout the World. Yes, there can be delays with other Vendors but, there are delays within the Boeing company getting out product as well. Take the possibility of the Strike going into effect....That would cause a delay wouldn't it? Does any of this make sense to you? Your a Liberal....probably not.
17. Anyone been by Salt Lake City lately? Lots of companies moving to Utah. Educated workforce with a pretty good work ethic. Clean environment. Reasonable taxes. Available land for development. Boeing would fit right in.
18. Wow.
Every time there are threads here that are IAM related, it's hard to believe intelligent, patriotic Americans wrote them.
1) Tom @ 15. Damn, you're ignorant. The largest carbon fiber makers in the world may be HEADQUARTERED in Japan, but have you ever heard of TORAY?!?! In Pierce County, WA? Jeezuz H! Put down the crack pipe!
2) Since when did it become patriotic to move jobs to a totalitarian, COMMUNIST DICTATORSHIP like RED F***ing CHINA?!? It's not! Anyone who wants to move jobs to RED CHINA is no different than wanting to have moved jobs to Nazi Germany or the Soviet Union. You have zero American patriotism and are in fact a traitor to this country. Leave now! You are NOT wanted in this country!
3) Hey, how is that offloading thing working for BA?!?! Oooooooooooops. Major boner! NO ONE ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD knows what or how to make aerospace structures like the UNIONIZED designers and builders @ BA! The IAM was on time with the 707, 727, 737, 757, 767, & 777. Because of its size and complexity we were 3 months late with the 747. WE are ON-TIME with our parts of the 787. It's all the vendors/suppliers, most of whom have never made ANYTHING more complex than a shoe-box (but, damn they are CHEAP!) that are ruining the schedule and quality of the 787 & 747-8!
4) I've called you out before Earling. You haven't posted anything detailing your VAST KNOWLEDGE of aerospace manufacture. Please. BA management can't do it w/out you! The McD management running the place needs serious help. Surely in your vast treasure trove of aerospace experience you can help 'em out. They're not doing a very good job w/ all the offloading. The Japs, the Italians, the Chinese, the Aussies, the Mexicants, the old Soviets. Any of 'em.
You really wanna fly on a "cheaper" airplane? I'd rather fly on the BETTER airplane!
Offloading to ignorant, backwater countries who HAVE NEVER BUILT ANYTHING nearly as advanced as what WE AMERICANS HAVE (last time anybody checked it was the OLD pre-merger BOEING THAT GOT AMERICA to the MOON!!!!!!!!!!).
Your un-American, ANTI-American, worship-MONEY-before-ANYTHING threads are DISGUSTING! THIS is why America is DYING! BECAUSE of Corporate greed and the ignorant sycophantic zealots who have never designed nor built anything BUT SURE THINK THEY KNOW HOW!
Thanks for being so unpatriotic. Why don't you vote for Obama while you're at it? You sound as ignorant as he does!
19. Hey....... cmiklich @18 Toray Industries, Inc. is an International Company with plants in Japan, Europe and the U.S. It's Carbon Fiber operation is in Decatur Alabama Not, in Pierce County Washington. So your the DUMB Loud Mouth HOG Not, Tom!
Your Gripe about Boeing having some work done in China shows how little you know about marketing large expensive products Internationally. If you want market access to China a.k.a. China buying your planes then, you got to share some of the wealth and work on the project. Airbus is doing the same thing in China. It is the way business has to be done if your competitor, Airbus is doing it. It's all about meeting the competition in selling a product.
The rest of your screed is so Idiotic it is not worth commenting on. The IAM is a Union that will call a Strike and delay production. It is the planners, management and others who schedule and bring things together and direct the workers to make it happen not, the IAM.
I have a Strong suspicion that anybody as Dumb, Loud Ranting and showing such Ignorance as you have......That your a Liberal and not a Conservative.
20. Yo Daniel:
From THEIR website:
Toray Composites(America), Inc. (TCA)
Head Office 19002, 50th Ave.,E., Tacoma, WA 98446, U.S.A.
Tel:(1)253-846-1777 Fax:(1)253-846-3897
Main Business Manufacture and marketing of carbon fiber prepregs for aircraft
Golly. That must be why the boxes (and boxes) of Toray Composites all have the Freddy address on them...
Sorry, fella. I actually WORK @ BA. Unlike the planners and management ("supervision" is a more accurate description since they can only watch other people work, giving precious little input since they have little experience in working themselves).
The chart makers make it happen?
When was the last time you flew a chart?
21. cmiklich @20......I'm well aware that TCA does carbon fiber prepegs in Tacoma. But, they DON'T make the carbon fibers itself in Tacoma. The carbon fibers are manufactured, in the U.S., in Decatur Alabama.....Get it? When Thomas B. said no carbon fibers are manufactured in the Northwest, he is CORRECT!
Don't be so Arrogant as to think salaried workers can't do any of the jobs of the IAM workers. Also, there are a good number of IAM workers who are quality and honest workers that would tell the Union to go to Hell if they could. Unforutnately, this is not a "Right to Work" State and they are Forced to join the IAM. Talk about a workers Communist environment you claim to disdain. So Wise up and get REAL!
22. Hmmmm...
Golly, Danny, do you work with composites @ BA? Which program? Which building?
Let's see, Danny. You would equate folks being given a choice to work and join a union with folks being forced, at the point of a gun, to work doing whatever slave-labor task the government decides.
Because Airbus is doing something, America must too? This surely is a race to the bottom, with "conservatives" leading the charge.
No wonder America is losing the culture war: So called "conservatives" see no difference between totalitarianism and a labor union.
23. cmiklich.....Your such a total Liberal Fool. You have no understanding of the Business World and how it is to compete with other Entities. No matter how clearly things are explained to you......you still don't get! Free Choice is the bases of Freedom. If you must join a Union and pay them money every month in order to have a Job, that is called Tyranny. Tyranny is not what America and Freedom stand for. It is what Liberals stand for and accept. Liberals don't respect Truth or Freedom. Liberals have proved time and time again that they are the Enemies of America and the Freedom that America represents. Nuff said.
24. Danny, Danny, Danny...
The word is "you're". Next up would be "basis". Looks like public school let another set of parents down. Now -there- is a union to be upset about.
But, the first topic is freedom. Just to inform you, BA is not a closed shop. You have the right to be an "agency shop employee", i.e., non-union (or "scab"). You also have the right to be a "conscientious objector" (for religious or other reasons). These rights do not apply in places like RED China.
Secondly, I have a very thorough understanding of the business world. What you call "business" is more aptly named "corruption". Trading with RED China (communism), as Reagan noted with welfare queens, will only get you more of the same. BJ Clinton, no conservative he, opened the door to unmitigated trade with RED China. You know a blog has gone left when so-called "conservatives" applaud BJ.
Please, Danny, call yourself "progressive" or put in a bid to be Goldstein's b**ch, but don't call yourself "conservative". It is offensive to those of us who applaud folks like Mr McCain for suffering through his tortures for this country at the hands of the RED Chinese' close ally: The N Vietnamese.
As I posted above, BA is in serious straights regardless of the strike. All of the offloading dominoes are starting to fall. MOF, BA may very well SHOW ZERO PROFIT or LOSSES(!!) within 2 years because of all the offloading to ignorant, backwater, corrupt, third-world countries.
Like Danny's paradise: RED China.
25. cmiklich......Thank you for the correction to my weakness in spelling. I should have known to be more careful with the likes of you who will jump on grammatical errors rather than, the substance of what is written.
You are Wrong about being free from the Union if you are a machinist. You STILL have to pay into their coffers regardless. That being the case, means your STILL their Prisoner. Get it? You are also, full of CRAP when, you run off at the mouth saying the you have a thorough understanding of the business world. What a Lying Joke you are.
You may call yourself whatever you like but, your still a Liberal by the manner in which you spew, proves it time and time again.
BA is NOT in serious straights. After all, Airbus is their major competition and can't even get their 380 going let alone, their 350. I could go into the details of how the Strike is going to play out but, your too much of a Liberal to understand so, why bother.