December 13, 2007
So Far, No Takers

It has been 24 hours and I have received no responses to this offer.  Which, if I say so myself, is quite generous.  In effect, I am offering to post a free advertisement here for any of the three leading Democratic candidates for president.

It can't be that first condition that's holding them back, can it?

(Incidentally, if any of the area's leftist web sites make a similar offer, please let me know.   I would jump at a chance to list the accomplishments of several of the Republican candidates.)

Posted by Jim Miller at December 13, 2007 07:14 AM | Email This
Comments
1. Jim,
I would take you up, but given all that you requested, would take time. You could just go to the candidate's website. Obama's factcheck.barackobama.com has plenty of information regarding his Illinios legislative experience, like working together with both sides on the issue of taping of police interrogations/death penalty cases. He didn't cave to either side and worked out a pratical, implementable solution that both sides (police and death penalty opponents) could agree to. On the flip side, you could also look at the 2004 debate write-ups with him and Alan Keyes to see that other side of Obama in regards to Abortion and his not backing banning Partial Birth Abortions bill. This is probably the only issue that concerns me about Obama. On the one hand he has demonstrated he can bring disparate sides together, yet on the other hand, when it comes to some issues, he will continue the pandering to one side of the issue, irrespective of the voices on the other.

Of course, I can find this inconsistency in all the major candidates (please Bruce G/Travis, I know Ron Paul has stuck to his guns all along).

As we have seen through history, however, most Presidents, especially if their is a split between the administration and congress, move towards the center in order to get things done.

Posted by: tc on December 13, 2007 07:35 AM
2. Jim,

Good offer! Keep up the good work. Goldy and his five regular posters over at horsesass don't have the balls it requires to post themselves or take you up on your offer.

Posted by: Mark1 on December 13, 2007 07:40 AM
3. I doubt you'll receive any responses, Jim, and I think it's due to the "accomplishments" thing. Democrats are famous for big talk, but other than raising taxes, usually accomplish very little. As an example, note our state's record on transportation issues....big tax increase with very little to show for it.

Posted by: Saltherring on December 13, 2007 08:00 AM
4. perhaps this is an interesting offer. the lack of responses might say something about the partisan nature of the readership here. also, the offer could just be an invitation to unleash a bunch of invective from posters here.

i notice not a lot of talk about w's accomplishments amongst the r candidates. why could that be? (rhetorical question).

Posted by: dinesh on December 13, 2007 08:19 AM
5. Bottom line reason you're getting no respons: foregone conclusion that Mrs Clinton will be our next POTUS....'nuff said!

Posted by: Duffman on December 13, 2007 09:08 AM
6. dinesh @ 4:

Jim requested summary postings lauding the accomplishments of Democrat candidates. The president was not the issue.

There are plenty of moonbat leftist trolls who read SP and post here regularly, as well as a few self-proclaimed "independents" and "moderates". Most, in the free market of ideas, should revel at the chance to highlight Democrat Party candidates. Why not? Afraid of constructive criticism outside your usual echo chambers? Afraid your candidates' "accomplishments", "principles" and "ideals" won't hold water?

Posted by: Saltherring on December 13, 2007 09:09 AM
7. The reason Jim will never get any responses is that Democrats cannot calmy state their case with facts in a civil manner. The argue on emotion with curse words thrown in for good measure. Go look at teh equine anal blog for a prime example.

Posted by: pbj on December 13, 2007 09:25 AM
8. Maybe you should have posted info on how to contact you....or opened up the comments section. Or better yet, try posting in on Goldy's site.

Why would you post something like that on here?

Posted by: Cato on December 13, 2007 09:48 AM
9. 1. Cato is correct, the original request had no address.

2. I am an independent and I am researching most candidates, but I think the best way to get a response is simply to e-mail the respective campaigns. Most people I know aren't working for a particular campaign, but are just watching, reading, and listening.

Posted by: WVH on December 13, 2007 09:55 AM
10. I don't think this is an indication that all Democratic voters have absolutely no idea why they support their candidates of choice. It's a lot of effort and some may fear that you're going to rip them to shreds - I don't know. But the truth is, they're probably unlikely to convince anyone reading your blog. Their loss maybe, but I'm not surprised by the lack of turnout.

Like Wilda, I've also found that going directly to campaigns is a good way of getting information. Most campaigns assume that undecided/independent voters contacting them are not idiots who simply want to hear about the [audacity/strength/power] of [hope/leadership/compassion]. And for those candidates who do assume that, well, their loss of my potential vote.

Posted by: Benjamin Johnstone-Anderson on December 13, 2007 10:08 AM
11. I for one would like to see the accomplishments of many of our elected representatives. Does anyone know of a site that lists the bills authored and passed by individual congress persons?

Posted by: dracer on December 13, 2007 10:08 AM
12. Dracer, you can find a searchable directory of Bills/Sponsors/Votes put forth by members of Congress here.

Posted by: Cato on December 13, 2007 10:33 AM
13. "[Y]our argument should be limited to what they have accomplished, especially as elected officials. I do not care whether they look good in a swimming suit (or bad in a pants suit), or whether they have had interesting lives, or whether they can talk really pretty. I want to know what, if anything, they have done."

Jim, I understand you're trying to get Democrats to think clearly about their candidates and I applaud this. Still, I have to play devil's advocate a bit.

I think your constraints are overly rigid - the lives, demeanor, and accomplishments outside elected office of candidates are entirely relevant to the office of the President.

The Great Communicator is the obvious example in recent history. What were his primary accomplishments as governor of California? Legalizing abortion and deploying the national guard to take on a bunch of hippies in Berkeley. Not much of a record to stand on, but I don't think many people would disagree that the man looked good, talked pretty, had an interesting life, and oh yes, he did a mostly bang-up job as president (that Iran-Contra business notwithstanding.)

Compare to GWB, who accomplished quite a lot as governor of Texas (passed tort reform, criminal-justice reform, and meaningful educational reform) but who hasn't in all honestly done a hot job as President, IMO. (Others may disagree on this point, but I don't know many who would say he's been a better president than Reagan.)

I'm not really interested in the accomplishments of the candidates in prior elected office as the be-all and end-all of choosing a candidate. Maybe the Democratic faction agrees?

Posted by: hang on a sec on December 13, 2007 10:48 AM
14. Posting an ad here on SP on behalf of one of the candidates is a generous offer?

SP attracts maybe 15,000 - 20,000 readers that are well set in their ways in a continually trending blue state that went for Kerry, Gore and Clinton twice.

How is this generous again?

Why don't you write a compelling essay on which candidates in the GOP field resembles change instead of usual old tired wedge issues, fear mongering and the status quo? Now, there's a challenge...

Posted by: Don't Flatter Yourself on December 13, 2007 10:56 AM
15. Cato,

Thanks for the link... Looking at what Senator Obama has accomplished in the 110th Congress, we see that exactly TWO bills that he sponsored or co-sponsored made it to the desk of the President:

1. S-5: A bill to amend the Public Health Service Act to provide for human embryonic stem cell research; VETOED

2. S.1352 : A bill to designate the facility of the United States Postal Service located at 127 East Locust Street in Fairbury, Illinois, as the "Dr. Francis Townsend Post Office Building"; signed into law.

So in the 110th Congress Senator Obama has succeeded in getting the name of a building changed. That's quite a record there!

Posted by: Edmonds Dan on December 13, 2007 11:09 AM
16. Jim, great offer but that first requirement does to the top dem tier what a sickle does to wheat.
But I'm going to offer up a couple accomplishments by one HRC
1, turned 10k into 100k by merely reading the investment pages in the paper
2, managed to get named after a famous mountain climber BEFORE he became famous
3, found the missing FBI files in her office
4, shown incredible patience to a husband that makes Ted Kennedy seem shy around women
And I'll end with this one,
5, made my singing voice sound good.

Posted by: PC on December 13, 2007 11:23 AM
17. Hey Dan, while your at it you should look how many Bills that Thompson sponsored/co-sponsored made it to the President's desk.

He had none his first year...5 the second year...the only one he actually sponsored renamed a courthouse in Tennessee. Seems like Fred was doing some heavy lifting in Congress as well.

Posted by: Cato on December 13, 2007 11:45 AM
18. Cato @17 -

Thank-you for a classic demonstration of ignoratio elenchi.

By attempting to change the subject, you are conceding the point, which is that the Dem candidates have no accomplishments worthy of mention.

Posted by: ewaggin on December 13, 2007 11:59 AM
19. By attempting to change the subject, you are conceding the point, which is that the Dem candidates have no accomplishments worthy of mention.

If your talking about lack of accomplishments in the Senate it only seems fair to compare Thompson's record as a Senator to Obama's record as a Senator.

Not my fault that you can't handle the truth about the sheer lack of accomplishments put forth by the "new Reagan".

Posted by: Cato on December 13, 2007 12:15 PM
20. Cato,

Well, if you want to play the game of "hey, ignore the failings you pointed out about my candidate, look at THIS GUY!", well we shall...

Take a look at the 107th Congress, Fred's last: SJ Res 6, SJ Res 22, S1202 (and for 1202, note that only Fred and Joe Lieberman - no other Senators - sponsored the bill which ultimately became law).

In the 106th, there's 9 bills, exactly one is the fluff of "name a building for person X", except in this case it was naming a building for Senator Moynihan.

In the 105th Congress, there's 5 bills - none are fluff - and all became law.

In the 104th Congress, there's 5 bills, one was a "name a building" fluff bill. All became law.

I think Fred's got a bit more Gravitas than Barak... Not to mention an actual TRACK RECORD of working in a bipartisan manner. You sure you want to go down this path?

Posted by: Edmonds Dan on December 13, 2007 12:31 PM
21. Hey Duffie.

Keep up the good face for Billary, but if you notice her numbers are dropping and look how she attacking Obama.
Then she turns around and says sorry.

Not looking good buddy, not at all!

LOL

Posted by: Army Medic/Vet on December 13, 2007 12:35 PM
22. Research. Cato, research!

(-:

Posted by: Army Medic/Vet on December 13, 2007 12:39 PM
23. AMV: But, good Sir - did you happen to see the debates (yesterday's Repugs) and today's Dem's?
First of all there was no comparison in terms of overall substance of debates. Today you could conceivably imagine ANY one of the candidates as a viable POTUS...whereas yesterday's debate was a literal JOKE. I don't think the American public (regardless of politics) could really fathom ANY one of the Repugs as this country's President.
Today, even tho the only female on stage (and whether you admit it or not is a bit of a disability to start with..because of 'perception') I believe Mrs Clinton was the most authoratative and best answered questions like a leader should (see debate recap for details). I'm not worried in the least - when (in Jan) it becomes obvious that she indeed will be the nominee - the Dem treasure chest will kick in behind her and she will literally C-R-U-I-S-E into the White House.
We are about to witness a 'first' in this Country and I'm glad I'm alive to see it. All you 'deep analysts' on this blog will finally see that I was right from the start.
And I call her Mrs Clinton (instead of Hillary) because this time we REALLY do get 'two-for-one', and Bill Clinton will be an integral part of our next administration. I will save your post AM/V and re-post it after the Nov '08 election. :)

Posted by: Duffman on December 13, 2007 12:45 PM
24. tc's response seems honest to me. I will just remind everyone that 1,000 words is the maximum and that I have set the time limit at the end of the year. Shorter pieces would be fine, and most people have some free time after Christmas.

Two commenters have said that the original post had no contact information. I am embarrassed to mention this, but there are two links on this site that will give you the answer immediately. I had not thought -- and still have trouble believing -- that my Democratic friends would not be able to find those links without my help. (And I am a little hurt to learn that they do not visit my site regularly.)

As for evaluations of Bush, I did one when he was running for president in 2000. (The comparison to Gore was written before I had my web site, which is why it looks different.) If Bush runs again, I'll do another.

And I am doing my own evaluations of the presidential candidates, giving them what I call Vilsack ratings. (I've gotten behind on that, but hope to catch up after Christmas.) I asked for supporters to provide their own descriptions of what the top three Democratic candidates had accomplished in part to get a view from the other side, in case I missed something.

Finally, for the record, I have already emailed one prominent Obama supporter asking him to take the challenge, and I plan to email others who support Obama, Clinton, and Edwards. I tend to avoid R-rated sites, but if Goldstein were to point out my challenge, I would be happy to link to his post. (Or, if he were to accept my challenge and write a post at his own site, I would be happy to link to that, too.)

Posted by: Jim Miller on December 13, 2007 01:01 PM
25. Yes I did and talk about DUMB questions and the hand thing Please. Even the news laughed at it, but if you think this is going to help Hillary. I have this 1968 UH-1 to sell you. Hardly used but a few air holes in it. LOL

Posted by: Army Medic/Vet on December 13, 2007 01:04 PM
26. By the way Duff. The polling numbers are not about Dems & Rep. It's about Hillary and the other dems. This is where her numbers are falling.

Posted by: Army Medic/Vet on December 13, 2007 01:07 PM
27. True, in the 109th Congress Obama had 13 bills make it to the Presidents desk only one of those was fluff and a number of them were bi-partisan. That's still more than Thompson.

Meanwhile Hillary in the 109th has co-sponsored 2 fluff bills, 2 real bills of which 1 was vetoed & 1 became law. While in 108th she has 20 bills, 8 of them are fluff, and all became law.

Wow, looks like Clinton and Obama both have done a whole lot more than Thompson did during his time in office. Considering 110th Congress only started on Jan 3rd, 2007 and goes till Jan 3rd, 2009 it stands to reason that they have plenty of time to put forth more bills for the President to sign.

Posted by: Cato on December 13, 2007 01:09 PM
28. I hear by offer to pay for an ad in the Seattle Times
for a full week if you can show me one way that the Republican party is conservative-especially on the national level. Smaller government-no The right to be left alone by the government-no, Fiscally conservative-no or low deficits-no, Christian values-no (thou shall not lie, Tghou shall not kill, Thou shall not torture, Support the constitution-no, (domestic spying, torture, war crimes, habeas corpus gone) and on and on. I'm conservative, fiscally and socially. I'm no Republican.

Posted by: Joe Futawn on December 13, 2007 01:09 PM
29. ...and therein lies 'one' of many reasons that we will be sayin PRES Clinton...yet AGAIN!

Posted by: Duffman on December 13, 2007 01:15 PM
30. Duffer, there's no place like home.... no place like home.... no place like home.

Posted by: Hinton on December 13, 2007 01:28 PM
31. Joe, how big of an Ad are we talking here?

Posted by: Cato on December 13, 2007 01:28 PM
32. I'm no Republican

That's fine Joe, we don't want you anyway!

Posted by: Army Medic/Vet on December 13, 2007 01:29 PM
33. State Rep. Fred Jarrett R-Mercer Island, is quitting the Republican Party and will run next year for the state Senate as a Democrat. His move, a year before the election, means the former Republican legislative stronghold through east King County is now pure Democratic territory. "I am not leaving the Republican Party" said Rep. Jarrett. "the Republican party left me. It has become a party of religious extremists who do not hold traditional Republican values of fiscal responsibility, and smaller government. It is more concerned with interfering in citizen's personal lives than governing responsibly."

Posted by: Joe Futawn on December 13, 2007 08:58 PM
34. Cato @19 -

Ah, I see that "your" (did you mean you're?) attempting to change the subject again.

So, thank-you for conceding the point...again.

Posted by: ewaggin on December 13, 2007 09:19 PM
35. Duffie -

Homer called; he said that if you're done looking at the world through a drunk's eyes, he wants his BeerGoggles back.

Posted by: ewaggin on December 13, 2007 09:22 PM
36. Whaddya know: a Jim Miller posting with an open comment thread.

Posted by: Daniel K on December 13, 2007 11:40 PM
37. ewaggin, you want accomplishments, I compared accomplishments between the top-tier Dem's and the GOP candidate of similar stature. Since the cross-dressing Mayor and the flip-flopping Governor don't have Senate voting records it makes it hard to compare Apples with Oranges.

Posted by: Cato on December 14, 2007 10:26 AM
38. From #3: Democrats are famous for big talk, but other than raising taxes, usually accomplish very little.

I find they're not even known for "big talk". What they seem to be best at is attacking the current administration (in between attacking each other, that is).

While I don't agree with everything that Bush and company have done, I feel they've done a good job in some very difficult times. The dem contenders can, and do, choose to latch on to some perceived shortcomings. They attack, demean, accuse and complain. They almost never offer up any substantial suggestion as to how they would do things any better. I find it very frustrating to listen to them, as anyone who is paying attention is going to naturally expect some idea of a plan.

If they replaced all the attacks and negativity with even a few original, bold, creative or really ANY ideas of their own they might see their precious poll numbers increase. On that front, the Republican candidates at least seem willing to address the issues and have some constructive discussion.

Posted by: Zarro on December 14, 2007 06:10 PM
Post a comment
Name:


Email Address:


URL:


Comments:


Remember info?