Check out this Everett Herald article on a speech former 787 program chief Mike Bair gave in Snohomish County. Sounds like the 787 supply chain won't be replicated in full for a 777 or 737 replacement in the future thanks to problems with some of the partners tasked with assembling components for the current project; problems that are more notable than previously indicated by the company.
UPDATE: here's the Times coverage too. Note the point that since they'd like their partners to be clustered together rather than spread around the globe for future such airplanes that it's an open question whether the Puget Sound region would retain the assembly lines for the 777 and/or 737 replacement models.
Posted by Eric Earling at November 01, 2007 07:45 AM | Email ThisDon Brunell says our tax structure is poor for business.
http://www.columbian.com/business/businessNews/2007/10/10302007_Watch-out-Washington-or-Boeing-may-fly-away.cfm
Sad isn't it. Thanks you Dem's. If Boeing leaves this state it take one heck of a HIT!
Posted by: Army Medic/Vet on November 1, 2007 09:40 AMBetween horrific transportation congestion, the Machinist union, nanny state regulation, hostility to business, Washington is in a long goodbye kiss with Boeing.
Our own political niativity, stupidity, and immaturity drives out a homegrown world class business.
Any half wit could see the parallels with GM, Ford, Chryser/UAW and Boeing/Washington/Machinists.
Unfortunately, Olympia has so very few half wits, mostly no wits.
Thanks, Democrats!!
Posted by: Hank on November 1, 2007 09:44 AMThe state will take one heck of a HIT!
Posted by: Army Medic/Vet on November 1, 2007 09:49 AMWhat's really too bad, is that many of the union employees are good people with great skills that could probably earn more than what they are being paid by the union. But, once you get hypnotized, or just plain locked in to a union lifestyle, it's hard to break free. And so, you get use to high benefits, and you get use to looking the other way when you support high pay for those who do a poorer job, but are still part of the brotherhood. And then there's the administrative overhead of the union fat cats. Money that would otherwise go in to the pockets of skilled and talented employees in an open shop, because a good company would want to retain such talent. Or if nothing else, lower the total payroll costs, that are a big hit to the bottom line of a large employer like Boeing.
Democrats want it both ways. They want lots of tax revenue from successful companies, but then they want to blow it on supporting all kinds of collectivism, that does not support it's own weight. Eventually, the bottom falls out, and everyone is left hurting. Look for the same thing to happen with Social Security and Hillarycare as well. Real value costs money, and all that money in the government comes from somewhere.
Far better to simply do the right thing in the beginning, and acknowledge the hard market reality that you can't get something for nothing.
Posted by: Jeff B. on November 1, 2007 10:16 AMThere's only so much the State can do before they end up in a Sonics like stalemate.
You guys would be happy if they left, traffic would be a lot more manageable. =P
Washington's state tax structure is poor for new businesses, as they must pay the B&O tax even if they don't make a profit.
However, many established businesses (Boeing included) resist changes, as a profit-based tax would place a greater share of the tax burden on them.
Posted by: ewaggin on November 1, 2007 12:02 PMDon't confuse tax breaks with subsidies.
Airbus has flourished, at Boeing's expense, on subsidies provided solely for their benefit by (primarily) the French and German governments.
The tax breaks that Boeing received for locating the 787 final assembly line in Washington are available to any company, including Airbus, that makes a similar commitment.
Posted by: ewaggin on November 1, 2007 12:30 PMI guess cato failed Econ-101.
Yeah less people and a LOT less tax money Cato and we know darn well the taxes will never go down. But heck you don't mind paying more do you?
I thought you hated taxes? Are you implying that you've found a new found love for them? That reminds me isn't King County Proposition 1 about raising my property taxes so you can keep doing your job? =)
Bye Bye Gregoire, Bye Bye Sims, Bye Bye Nichols!
We need some new leadership in this state!
Posted by: GS on November 1, 2007 05:32 PM2007 State Business Tax Climate Index
This was interesting...
Lawmakers do, however, have
direct control over how friendly their tax systems
are to business. Furthermore, unlike changes to a
state's health care, transportation, or education system--
which can take decades to implement--
changes to the tax code bring almost instantaneous
benefits to a state's business climate.
A Basic of conservatism: When the individual works, the individual is rewarded. At BA, it is the reverse.
When a worker, engineer or assembler, invents, creates, improves or otherwise outproduces, sure as the sun will rise, some "manager" will be there to take credit and put it all on a chart.
A basic of communism is the henny-penny theory: The worker works and everybody else gets rewarded. This is BA writ large today. Lots and lots of chart-makers, damned few part makers.
Truism: BA's customers pay for parts. Big ones. They are called airplanes (or other aerospace products). They do not pay for charts. The adage inside of BA today is "make charts, not parts".
True story: I'm part of a group that is instrumental in travelling around the world attempting to teach those who have NEVER MADE SOMETHING SO COMPLEX AS AN AIRPLANE how to do so. In Japan (won't say which factory), there are damned few of us, but damned too many managers (but not ones who have any history of actually doing anything). On one wall there are rows and rows (and rows) of charts. A member of my group walked over to the dozens of managers trying to absorb all the useless drivel on these charts and made the comment (jokingly) "What you guys need is a chart to track all these charts". They looked at him like he was Newton discovering gravity. "You're right", they said, "We need a chart to track all the charts..."
Sad.
Mike Bair, disgraced moron, a fellow who never made or did anything, was put in charge of something he had no experience at: Putting out a product. This is why the 787 program is in deep ca-ca.
I've said it before and I'll say it again: When you want to buy a product or service, do you go to the guy who has done it literally thousands of times, or do you go to the guy who has never done it, but did read a book on the theory of how to do it?
I'm willing to pay a little more and get it DONE RIGHT THE FIRST TIME. BA is managed today, not by folks who rose through the ranks after having spent years designing and building, but by folks who read a book (or 3) and make really, really pretty charts.
Posted by: cmiklich on November 2, 2007 09:19 AM