November 21, 2005
How to Start Fixing Seattle Public Schools
I've watched in a public meeting as Seattle parents wanting to be sold on the city's public schools shook their heads in disgust when school officials answered no, they wouldn't do away with teacher seniority perks that keep low performers in the system, and that prevent principals from matching teaching talent with student needs. Until Seattle Public Schools get serious about negotiating contracts that benefit students instead of the teachers union, we've got a real problem. Other cities are considering, or taking action; and we need to, as well. A new study helps explain why. Just substitute "Seattle" for "L.A." in this L.A. Times editorial titled, "The ABCs Of School Reform."
A recent study show how union contracts can hamper school improvement — and provides another compelling reason why having L.A.'s mayor run the schools could help. The study by the nonprofit New Teacher Project found that teacher contracts place seniority over what's best for students, especially by favoring longtime teachers for desired teaching slots over newer teachers who might be better for the job. That's true even if the more senior teacher is needed in another school.
Poor and minority students have long borne the brunt of these rules, because teachers often want jobs in more affluent communities. Though disadvantaged students need more educational support, they end up with the least experienced teachers. The accountability movement is putting the spotlight on these long-standing practices, but unions have adamantly resisted change. A strong mayor might be able to turn the tide. In October, New York Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg reached an accord with the teachers union that eliminates job assignment by seniority. The new contract also lengthens the school year by two days and the workday by 10 minutes.
That kind of tough negotiating is possible from a school board, but unlikely. The fragmented nature of school boards, whose members are little known and run low-budget campaigns, allows contributions from unions to play a disproportionate role in elections. Last week, in separate speeches to business groups, Los Angeles Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa delivered his strongest statements since taking office about the need for mayoral control over schools. The mayor is right in saying that unions and the school board will fight to maintain the status quo, and he will need extraordinary support from business and the public. They should provide it.
Improving teacher quality in the schools of Seattle's poorest neighborhoods is crucial, even if many suburbanites and city residents have blithely washed their hands of the problem. But improved instruction in the city's worst schools is just one piece of Seattle school reform; closely orienting the school district to the needs of more-ready students is another.
An appointed school board directly accountable to the Mayor of Seattle will not guarantee success, but its continued absence will ensure deepening failure.
The New Teacher Project's study, titled, "Unintended Consequences: The Case For Reforming The Staffing Rules in Urban Teachers Union Contracts," is here; a detailed, six page, press-release summary from last week, is here; a Web page with recommendations of the study from educators, plus links to the study and press release, here.
Should there be a Seattle voter initiative for an appointed school board? The policy would raise expectations that school tax monies should be used to help deliver a solid education for every K-12 public school student in Seattle. The policy would provide an additional, diversity-enhancing benefit. If Seattle's mayor is held accountable for public schools, all manner of liberal claptrap related to public education here would necessarily be under the microscope. The city's political culture could gradually undergo a serious shift, as the defacto emphasis turns away from empty-nesters, the childless and Nanny State apologists to.....families, common sense and taxpayer bang-for-buck. Think about it.
Posted by Matt Rosenberg at November 21, 2005
11:59 AM | Email This
1. you can count on $250 million to oppose any initiative to reform WA state public schools. Makes you wonder where they get all that money, and they have the gall to complain about lack of funds for schools.
2. If we're going to have unions in schools... we should have _student_ unions. Watch the WEA have conniption fits.
3. Vouchers lets you bypass the unions reducing their power. Why did they say they are against vouchers again?
4. The most important factor in a child's education is parental involvement. Without getting the parents involved, both parents, father and mother, do not expect to see quality education.
5. This is a tough one! I don't suspect anyone could get ANY improvements to public education in Washington with the WEA around. Those guys will fight like banshees to protect their perks and salaries, and they've got the politicians already bought and paid for! Good luck making any improvements!
6. From what I remember reading about Antonia Villaraigosa, he was quite propped up by unions like SEIU, etc. I don't know if this means he's backing away from so much radical union support, but I have reservations about his comments.
If the mayor of Seattle were to take charge, wouldn't the teacher's union simply pile dollars into the mayoral candidate of their choice and then press him to appoint the people they wanted? That seems the most likely scenario in THIS town and state. It's certainly the case that union special interests are running the show in Olympia with Gregoire and co., which is why nothing really good ever happens governmentally in WA.
7. The correct term is "child-free", not "childless". Calling someone "childless" gives the incorrect impression that they actually want children. Unless you are in a position to know for certain, the default position should be that they have chosen to not have children for their own reasons.
8. Hey- I have a simple solution: Call the unions "racist" for steering the "better" teachers away from the schools that are poorest and most in need of help and then the unions will have to shape up & comply. Well---that's how the left seems to do it and it work every time for them.
9. It is a shame that within the same school district there is such a disparity in the education a child can receive.
I can see there being differences between districts, but in the same district?
Children should be able to receive the same quality education within a single school district regardless of where that school physically resides.
If they can't, then why not? Isn't that what our state constitution guarantees them? Isn't this what our politicians promise them? Isn't this why we hire teachers in the first place?
10. Not quite H Moul... It is not a matter of choice but ability. Surprised me when I looked it up, I thought it was without child whether or not by choice. Live and learn!
childless - adjective
Unable to produce offspring: barren, impotent, infertile, sterile, unfruitful.
11. There is more to it that just the dictionary definition, which is heavily slated toward the pre-contraceptive era of family planning.
Trust me on this - the overwhelming majority of people today who don't have kids are that way by choice.
12. Well, Washington is expecting a windfall of 1.4 billion, educators are already lining up to get as much of it as they can come January. They just received billions from Gregoire and legislators last session, why not more? It reminds of a TV commercial - Throw money at the problem, as much as you can find, and then raise taxes to get more.
13. In the Socialist Soviet of Seattle the schools will remain in a death spiral as long as current power structure remains. It is about power of the Union, feel good mis-education, driven by the intent of liberal indoctrination.
The Seattle Schools have long since abandoned any semblance of education in favor of the above tenants of liberal dogma.
Until the voter base in Seattle changes the schools will continue on the current course.
14. I'm convinced there is only one way to truly fix all the problems with education. And it's a real simple solution.
This solution is used to efficiently create and distribute most everything we use in our daily lives, from water, food, clothing, to entertainment and consumer electronics. It has made the US the most disproportianetly wealthy country in the world, and probably in the history of the world. In fact, every experiment or system established contrary to the principles that run this country have shown to be sorely lacking and inferior.
That solution is called capitalism. And it is implemented quite simply by revoking all public education funding by the government. Leave that money in the hands of the people who know how to manage it best, and let them solve the problem.
I am convinced that if Bill Gates and associates established their own schools according to their own rules that they could do no worse than the communists who run the WEA. In fact, he would probably do much, much, better.
15. So true, Mr. Gardner! As to the notion of unions - how about parent unions? How to exercise clout? Get a large enough group of people to join and use enrollment as a lever. If a child is gone for a day, the school loses funding for that child for that day. A one-day massive pull out of students would be enough to show them we mean business! These are people who use protest as their main weapon. Turn it back on them! Pick your axe and grind it! Start with PC curriculum or whatever (every district has its issues). Once I mentioned this protest idea to a friend who is a teacher and was amazed when she dissolved in tears! I felt kind of mean because she's a nice woman and all - but just the same, it is our children's education that is at stake. Playing the nice parent doesn't get you anywhere!
16. The followingt is very interesting.
Mel
RICHLAND SCHOOL DISTRICT DECLINES TO
ADMINISTER ADDITIONAL STATE-MANDATED WASL TESTING
http://www.rsd.edu/nomorewasls/1108resolution2.pdf
17. Public schools have become a "big business". I know there are some dedicated and good teachers, but the unions and the district administration offices have their own self-serving agendas. From past experience I can attest to the fact that very few parents will get involved in their child's school. This allows the schools to go virtually unchallenged. Unfortunately it is the kids that are getting short-changed.
18. Do some objective research on charter schools. You'll find that for the most part their results in math and reading, writing,and science are worse than the public schools'. $80 million dollars of your federal tax money this year was given to PRIVATE pressure groups trying to discredit public education. You people don't seem to realize that the goal is not to improve education, but to kill teachers' unions. That's not going to improve education. Telling you that privatization improves education is a flat out lie.
19. Here's the usual crowd of self-styled "conservatives" who are willing to spend hundreds of billions of dollars in Iraq for whatever it is we're trying to accomplish there. But just can't bear the thought of paying a few bucks to educate their neighbors kids.
Nevermind those kids are the next generation of productive members of society that will support these folks in their old age.
20. Come on, whiz... you know we both have a right to corrupt America's youth. We'll take the ones with gonads and turn them into a force for doing good in the world, and you take the rest and turn them into... well..., Democrats.
21. Witz;
Here's the difference as simple as I can make it.
Iraq is working.
Seattle schools don't.
22. Speaking of schools and Iraq.
Micheal Yon posted pictures of Iraqi school kids.
Witz how much are those smiles worth?
23. Iraq is working? You must be brain dead.
Are those smiles worth 50,000 dead humans? Are they 10,000 dead humans? How about 5,000? You pick a number.
And you guys accuse the left of ad hominem, 'feels good' arguments. Show a few happy faces and you think it settles the issue.
24. If Iraq is working, why are the good guys wearing black hoods to conceal their identity?
25. If Iraq is working, why do 59% of the American people say it is not working?
26. If Iraq is working, why are Republican politician avoiding it like the plague?
27. Witz since when do opinion polls determine anything? The MSM refuses to print anything positive about Iraq.
Al-Qaeda in Iraq is sending senior members into Jordan as bombers that alone tells anyone with a wit of intelligence more than watching CNN 24/7.
I have asked you repeatedly what price is your freedom worth.
From your selfish remarks the blood and treasure spent to create and maintain this republic is wasted on you.
50 million people in Iraq and Afghanistan have gained self determination.
I have said before and I say it again:
Never in history have so many be freed from tyranny at such a low cost in lives and treasure.
NEVER.
How what's your problem?
28. For the latest from our 'Idiot in Chief', check out http://www.comcast.net/providers/fan/popup.html?v=47274508&pl=47274767.xml&config=%2Fconfig%2Fcommon%2Ffan%2Fhome%2Exml
29. For the latest from his brain dead supporters, see the post above.
30. First, I don't have kids so perhaps all you defenders of the status quo in the schools will see some impartiality in my comments.
Look at that top 100 (200, 300..) list of High Schools in the US (NewsWeek (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7723397/site/newsweek). You sure don’t find any in Washington (at least in the first couple of hundred that I read). While there are no total by state list, I sure see a lot in NY, NJ, FL. One thing I know is that NY and NJ have had standardized test, at the high school level for 60 plus years. I grew up in the NY system and while there are lots of things wrong with government in NY, one thing they seem to get right is standard testing and class content. It’s a dirty little secret you don’t and won’t see the education wonks in Washington talk about. In NY the Regents board tells each teacher what book they will use and what minimum content they must cover from that book. The Regent exam at the end of year in that subject this the goal for most. No whining about the stress it places on kids or the waste of time it is, the subjects it takes away from, or the individual choice teacher don’t have. Can you imagine in this state if one source told each teacher the book to use and the minimum content to cover? The one thing that has always puzzled me about teaching and particularly in this state is the underlying idea that everything has to be reinvented each year and that it needs to vary from say from one 9th grade math class in Lakewood to another in Federal Way. It’s the only profession that needs to repeat a course of action from year to year but yet seems to be completely bent on constant reinvention rather than refinement. You introduce standard testing like WASL and crap, all heck break loose. Why, because it demands a certain amount of repeatability and refinements. It also lends itself to examination of the teacher’s skills and improvement over time, which I suspect is the real complaint.
So while the education industry debates this in Seattle, more “customers” are taking their children elsewhere. Keep debating Seattle education, you will soon be in a room with no one that disagrees.
31. jeholmes, thanks for bringing the discussion back on topic. Everybody: let's please leave Iraq for another thread, and stay on the topic of the original post, or related education matters. Thanks.
32. jeholmes: New York lowered the difficulty of their tests. Hence, they are now , "the best!"
33. Yes, the purpose of charter schools is to destroy the unions. I don't know anyone who wasn't clear on that point. The unions are the problem. Who has any doubt of that now? Unlike industry, public schools can't go out of business when the unions bankrupt them.
Charter schools aren't a panacea. I've done my research on them. But you know what? Charter schools ARE working where they are applied properly. Hint: California was a terrible way to do charter schools. Have you ever heard of KIPP? They are working, and they are targeted at non-white, non-suburban, non-republican, non-rich people. Who's advocating this? The White rich republican elites. Because they want the young black kids who live in the cities under the rule of democrat tyrants to get educated and work out their own future.
And Unkl Witz, I am not relying on the next generation to support me. I am building up my own assets to pass on to the next generation. My interests in education is purely because I am supposed to help my neighbor. It's called charity. Look it up. It's a foundation of religion, which your type hates so much.
34. Matt R - No problem. The point of a education system in one way is to avoid the situation of having to spill blood so someone can have the right to have a purple stained finger.
35. J. Gardner: A business model does not work for every human enterprise. You do not have the keys to the kingdom. We are already spending hundreds of millions of dollars on charter schools and the only thing they can teach well is religion. They aree atrocious at anything else. Do you only want slogan spewing automatons?
36. There is no way to fix public schools. They are rotten to the core with multiculturism, political correctness and indoctrination on how to be an obedient ward of the state.
The only rational solution is to recognize that the government has a much business in running schools as it does in running, say, supermarkets.
And more importantly it must be realized that education is not a right. It is a commodity or service like bread, milk or banking. This idea causes some people to faint and swoon. They think that government has some sort of sacred duty to inculcate obedience, servility and service to the mob in every child. Learning about science, history and art are are just incidentials these days.
The solution is to disband public schools sell off the buildings and stop collecting taxes related to schools. In short order the market will sort out the chaos. The incompetents will be fired, the bloated administrations will be trimmed, the political correctness trashed and the power of choice restored to the parents.
37. I think that we need to STOP trying to fix Seattle schools. We have been "fixing" Seattle schools for as long as I can remember (and I've been on the planet for a half century +) and they do nothing but get worse by leaps and bounds. How long must parents wait for the next "fix" to do it's job? Past "fixes" lasted years and have condemned generation after generation to minimum wage jobs. The only thing that will fix Seattle schools is a voucher program or at the very least charter schools. The magic of the free market will cure the problem and a ton quicker than the next "fix".
38. The comments in the L.A. Times editorial about the teacher seniority system are contradictory:
“teacher contracts place seniority over what's best for students, especially by favoring longtime teachers for desired teaching slots over newer teachers who might be better for the job” (summary – new teachers are better)
“Poor and minority students have long borne the brunt of these rules, because teachers often want jobs in more affluent communities. Though disadvantaged students need more educational support, they end up with the least experienced teachers.” (summary – experienced teachers are better)
As these two quotes together imply, one cannot say that all experienced teachers are better than new ones, nor vice versa. Regarding seniority, it seems to me that teachers who have put a lot of time into their teaching careers should get some say over their assignment.
39. That sounds interesting..
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You can find exclusive gifts at :
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Dont forget about Christmas and your family!
40. There is no way to fix public schools. They are rotten to the core with multiculturism, political correctness and indoctrination on how to be an obedient ward of the state.
The only rational solution is to recognize that the government has a much business in running schools as it does in running, say, supermarkets.
I'm with you on that Bill K. The ranks of home educated children will continue to quickly grow as more (especially young) parents recognize govt. schools as indoctrination and baby-sitting centers they have generally become.
I've got two 2-year-olds, and the decision to home school was made long ago.
41. Josh - And your kids will grow up to be dysfunctional brats because they won't know how to interact with other kids. That's a good thing to do to your kids?!? I'd suggest you look at improving what we have and not withdrawing into your cave.
42. Ha! Thanks for helping me start my day with a laugh JohnJL! Actually, we get nothing but enthusiastic compliments from other folks on how well behaved our kids are, not to mention consistant surprise at how much they love to read. I wonder why that could be? Hint: they aren't enrolled in preschool....
43. Home schooled has worked great for three of my neighbors. Also three other neighbors send their kids to private school and they are doing great. I just yesterday had a run in with my son's school. They punished him for something he didn't do. When the rest of the class stood up and said he didn't talk during the class they were threatened. They were told if they do not stop talking they would all get detention. I found this out and immediately went and had a conference with both Vice Principles. They said that it was because my son was in the area the talking was so he got the detention. I told them about the teacher telling the students they would get in trouble for sticking up for my son. They said we will have a talk with the teacher and since we had this meeting your son doesn't need to serve detention. The only thing they asked was my son keep silent about what was said. My son was silent and the teacher still made him do the detention. The Vice even showed up to check and make sure my son was there. Than he told my son afterwards that he forgot to tell the teacher. Plus he didn't pull him out because he was not being harmed. So the Vice Principles lied to my son and me. I confronted them and they said it will not show up on his record. I told them they totally showed a lack of responsibility and they lied. They refuse to apologize to my son. This was just yesterday. My son is 3.95 averages with 0 missed days and 0 tardies. He is on the Leadership team and was the only student present during the interviews of the vice principles. I'm afraid all our schools are teaching students is to lie and stand by while innocent people get punished. I told that to the Principle yesterday and she said she is sorry. I told it to the Vice yesterday and she just smiled and said it wouldn't go on my son's record. Never apologized. That is how poor the school systems are in Marysville. Now I know why only three kids on my street attend public school. Because the public school system is totally lacking in morals and leadership.
44. The Complete List of the 1,000 Top U.S. Schools in Washington State
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8759025/site/newsweek
Public schools are ranked according to a ratio devised by Jay Mathews: the number of Advanced Placement or International Baccalaureate tests taken by all students at a school in 2004 divided by the number of graduating seniors.
Rank - School - Location - State - Index - Subsidized lunches**
24 | Interlake* | Bellevue | Wash. | 4.018 | 31
32 | Newport | Bellevue | Wash. | 3.809 | 6
41 | Bellevue | Bellevue | Wash. | 3.551 | 6
161 | International School | Bellevue | Wash. | 2.451 | 5
227 | Sammamish | Bellevue | Wash. | 2.182 | 30
437 | Garfield | Seattle | Wash. | 1.693 | 30
582 | Central Kitsap | Silverdale | Wash. | 1.475 | 12
678 | Lewis & Clark | Spokane | Wash. | 1.375 | 27
801 | Skyview | Vancouver | Wash. | 1.247 | 15.7
848 | Redmond | Redmond | Wash. | 1.211 | 1
852 | Kamiak | Mukilteo | Wash. | 1.206 | 10
907 | Olympia | Olympia | Wash. | 1.153 | 10.9
927 | Pasco | Pasco | Wash. | 1.134 | 68
969 | Sehome | Bellingham | Wash. | 1.098 | 18
993 | Issaquah | Issaquah | Wash. | 1.078 | 5.9
45. JohnJL says
"Josh - And your kids will grow up to be dysfunctional brats because they won't know how to interact with other kids."
Unlike the fine, upstanding, illiterate, functional gangsta citizens who come out of public school?
LOL
46. Think of the ranking. Does not WA state say we have better schools than Texas. Or is it my imagination. I see a lot more schools listed from Texas. Let see out of 1000 best schools WA can only get 15 on the list. If the distribution was even across the country we should have at least 20 schools listed. So we are below the average. I do not have time to figure out the distribution but when Texas can beat WA state on education there is a problem. In the top 100 Texas, New York and Florida. The number one school is from Alabama known for being a poor state. A state with little money can out perform our best school. It would also be interesting to see how much was spent per student at each school. Maybe these other schools are spending more money than we are per student. At least the Teachers union keeps complaining they need more money. I am sorry but I can not stomach these lies of the Democrats that say well our schools will get better when we get more money. I would like to know how other states can be so successful but then they dont have Seatle School district that spends more money than they budget for. I guess they need more money just to provide basic services because it is not their money.
47. What is interesting in the rankings is that all Bellevue schools appear. We don't have rich schools and poor schools, expectations are set high for everyone.
Seattle schools set very low expectations for the poor, and barely challenge the capable.
The calls to abolish public schools are tireseome. It isn't going to happen. So, find the models that work, and figure out how to change your own schools. Or move. It seems to be more productive than ranting about the evil monster.
48. Janet S: Your common sense approach would be much appreciated in many Seattle schools. If you live in Seattle why not run for a spot on the school board? The good of future generations is too important to entrust to partisan ranters of ANY stripe-- Right or Left.
49. I just have to answer a few of the comments here.
One, I just attended an open house for Lakeside School (the middle/high private school that Gates and Paul Allen attended). It is a fabulous place but chock-full of the multi-culturalism, diversity and world-view that so many of you decry. Same for University Child Development Center where Gates' daughter attends. So don't be so sure of what business types want in a school.
Second, in Seattle Public Schools parents do have many choices of where to send our kids. Transportation is a huge cost to our District because of this decision. I know that the assignment plan will be revamped for 2007-200 and we will surely see a cutback in choice. If charter schools (no better than public and, in many cases, worse) are your answer, good luck with that in this state. It failed 3 times and it will fail again if it rears its lackluster head.
I would agree with whoever said we need more streamlining and continuity of curriculum and teaching. SPS uses a horrible math (called TERC in the lower grades, CM in middle and Integrated in high) that doesn't even teach kids multiplication tables. Many schools and even individual teachers have deviated from this curriculum because it is so bad. We need to find what works and apply it across the board. We need to have AP and Honors in every high school (there are currently high schools trying to restrict or end it despite it being one of the top marks of rigor as seen by college admissions officers). We need a superintendent who is a leader and not a manager. And yes, despite being a liberal, I say we need more discipline in our schools with the idea that kids who want to learn are welcome in class and the troublemakers can sit in the hall.
50. Remember Gregoire's comment about Georgia schools recently?
http://seattle.bizjournals.com/seattle/stories/2005/11/14/tidbits1.html
Speaking with less than her usual diplomacy, Gregoire said that when it comes to education, Washington shouldn't compare itself with states such as Georgia and North Carolina, because doing so meant comparing Washington to "mediocrity."
"Georgia citizens are educated enough not to let somebody steal the governor's office," was the crisp reply of Dan McLagan, spokesman for Republican Gov. Perdue.
McLagan said that while Washington does score higher than Georgia on the Scholastic Aptitude Tests (SAT), the picture would be different if Washington tested 73 percent of students the way Georgia does.
"Georgia would be leaps and bounds ahead if we were testing at the same levels," he said.
Although Washington does have 3 schools in the top 100, Washington only has 15 in the top 1,000. Georgia has 25 schools in the top 1,000.
School #107, 160, 287, 330, 360, 469, 512, 579, 586, 600, 620, 653, 660, 689, 695, 699, 729, 754, 868, 889, 910, 919, 950, 952 & 955.
51. David embarrasses himself by saying:
I do not have time to figure out the distribution but when Texas can beat WA state on education there is a problem.
Do you think Texans are overly stupid? Do you think Seattlites are overly smart? What a snobbish, provincial attitude for a person to be burdoned with!
What other prejudices do you carry?
You can do better than making stupid, snap assessments that serve only to reveal your ignorance. Wake up, and keep your eye on the ball!
52. Hey JohnJL – you should check your facts before you stereotype. How many home schooled kids have turned out to be dysfunctional? (Answer: Almost Zero). How many publicly educated kids have turned out to be dysfunctional? (Just read the local newspaper...)
I was home schooled & I turned out remarkably well. Currently, I’m a Financial Analyst for a Fortune 500 company.
The problem with public schools is that they provide a one-size-fits-all education, but there’s a myriad of learning styles & abilities in the typical classroom. Being home schooled just like having a private tutor. Why does tutoring work? Individual attention! Why does home schooling work? Same thing!
53. Wesyello sez: "I would agree with whoever said we need more streamlining and continuity of curriculum and teaching. SPS uses a horrible math (called TERC in the lower grades, CM in middle and Integrated in high) that doesn't even teach kids multiplication tables. Many schools and even individual teachers have deviated from this curriculum because it is so bad. We need to find what works and apply it across the board. We need to have AP and Honors in every high school (there are currently high schools trying to restrict or end it despite it being one of the top marks of rigor as seen by college admissions officers). We need a superintendent who is a leader and not a manager."
How many times are we going to propose and change and evaluate and change and propose and get nowhere? This is the same thing we have been doing for decades that has gotten us to the point we are now. And we keep spiraling downward as kids don't get educated, drop out and jobs that REQUIRE an education go overseas. Vouchers now and cure the problem in less than two years. A far shorter time period than any program or host of programs now on the table or proposed (past experience being prolog) will do. Isn't insanity doing the same thing and expecting a different result? Cure the problem now and do vouchers now.
54. Wesyello sez: "I would agree with whoever said we need more streamlining and continuity of curriculum and teaching. SPS uses a horrible math (called TERC in the lower grades, CM in middle and Integrated in high) that doesn't even teach kids multiplication tables. Many schools and even individual teachers have deviated from this curriculum because it is so bad. We need to find what works and apply it across the board. We need to have AP and Honors in every high school (there are currently high schools trying to restrict or end it despite it being one of the top marks of rigor as seen by college admissions officers). We need a superintendent who is a leader and not a manager."
How many times are we going to propose and change and evaluate and change and propose and get nowhere? This is the same thing we have been doing for decades that has gotten us to the point we are now. And we keep spiraling downward as kids don't get educated, drop out and jobs that REQUIRE an education go overseas. Vouchers now and cure the problem in less than two years. A far shorter time period than any program or host of programs now on the table or proposed (past experience being prolog) will do. Isn't insanity doing the same thing and expecting a different result? Cure the problem now and do vouchers now.
55. I agree with S Prestek about vouchers. The issue of continual change of materials and methods of teaching is also true. Also, by continually modifying our methods of evaluating results we compound the confusion. I think the WASL should be scrapped and we should revert back to a long-standing method of testing. The SAT, for example, has been around for years. There is a wealth of accumulated data to use for making comparisons. It has been changed periodically, but not to the degree that the WASL has. It is also a less subjective test and less costly to administer. Most colleges require students to submit SAT scores when they apply. It makes sense from the standpoint of continuity and economy.
56. I mostly agree with you, Peggy. The SAT and the ITBS would be much more cost effective and more objective and more universal standardized tests. Washington State should abandon WASL for them. However, I am quickly losing conficence in SAT as they are moving more toward open-ended questions and more subjective scoring. In other words, SAT is starting to lose it, too.
57. Huckleberry: I know there was an essay portion added to the SAT, and that they had downsized the analogies section. What other changes have they made? Has the ACT remained relatively unaltered?
58. Peggy, you have identified the two changes I was aware of. Plus, they did a re-centering of the scores about 5 years ago that greatly inflated the scores relative to previous years, and seems to have favored one group of test takers over another by a half a percent or so.
I haven't heard much about ACT.
For me, the bottom line with achievement testing, as with voting, is to have the fewest number of eyes and brains interpreting the answers as possible.
59. Huckleberry: I don't know whether the ACT has changed much since I took it (back in the Pleistocene!). I just don't feel like the WASL is a good measure. My eldest son (I am embarrassed to admit) is currently failing his school classes, yet passed the WASL with flying colors. He is a good persuasive writer if nothing else! It doesn't give me much faith in the test.
My middle son is currently dealing with some fuzzy environmental content in his science class, and his very left-of-center social studies lessons leave much to be desired. I would not call this kind of instruction "education" so much as "indoctrination". I brought it up once with the teacher who went off on a rant about No Child Left Behind, Bush, oil and the Iraq War. As you may have guessed, I didn't accomplish anything by voicing my concerns. Am I wrong in thinking that most parents would like to keep political bias out of the classroom as much as possible? The aim should be to present facts, not opinions. Where opinions are likely to be elicited naturally (as in history classes), participation from all viewpoints should be allowed. As my husband's aunt says, everyone is entitled to an opinion, no matter how asinine!
Unfortunately, education based on opinions rather than facts doesn't really get you very far. Opinions are a dime a dozen. What you need more is a core of knowledge and skills.
60. Rather than follow the usual evangelical Christian anti-public schools clap-trap, I think better real-world examples abound.
Or, you can just go with Rush Limbaugh's silly home school / phonics garbage.
Why the United States Should Look to Japan for Better Schools
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/11/21/opinion/21mon4.html?ex=1132894800&en=8984f688fe38d4ad&ei=5070
61. GregL thinks America'a public schools represent the real world. He probably thinks his college campus does too. It'll be grand to check back with GregL in 20 or 30 years to see how well his reality in 2025 matches what he thinks is reality today.
62. Read and weep, or laugh, or whatever...
David Limbaugh on NCLB
I need to take a couple days off from this stuff...
63. The relationship between education unions and public school management is based upon a nefarious and inherent conflict of interest. This conflict cannot be resolved through disclosure, nor can it be waived. Union officals and agents need to be removed from policy making and administrative positions in schools and the state education bureaucracy. Until then, nothing will change.
64. How we fix public schools is a moot issue. It will continue to be an impossible dream unless and until we do one very important thing: decertify the WEA. As long as we continue to allow those child-robbing criminals to control our public education systems, we will never fix the problem. All we will do is forever be cleaning windows on the Hindenberg.