1. Huh, just under 300 illegally registered voters. What did Fraudoire "win" by? I wonder how these voters broke in the Rossi/Fraudoire race? Actually, no I don't. It's King County. 'nuff said.

Posted by: Danny on November 7, 2005 10:09 AM

2. Good grief, maybe it is time to ask for UN election observers in this thirld world country called King County.

Posted by: Fed on November 7, 2005 10:22 AM

3. I'm waiting to see these pictured plastered all over the front page of the Seattle newspapers. . . .

Tap .... Tap.... Tap....

Posted by: Matt from Olympia on November 7, 2005 10:27 AM

4. 288 illegally registered voters? When's the last time a race was decided by less than 288 votes?

Hello? Judge Bridges? Hello?

Posted by: Larry on November 7, 2005 10:31 AM

5. Don't blame Bridges. He can only act on what the Rs presented.

And remember, Rossi was pushing for a quick conclusion. He couldn't afford to push to get all these documents from the stallers.

Posted by: swatter on November 7, 2005 10:36 AM

6. A little here, a little there, and pretty soon you have the difference between someone winning the gov. race and someone losing.
I think Dean Logan HAS to take responsibility for correcting P.O. box registrations. He can't just sit there and say there's nothing he can do. Bullpatties!

Posted by: Misty on November 7, 2005 10:39 AM

7. Sorry, folks. Nobody's going to see any of the photos, or read any discussion about the illegally registered voters, because the P.I,. and Times don't care abut the truth. They only care about doing their part to get Sims re-elected, defeating I912, I300, etc., etc. They will continue to harp about the error throughout today and tomorrow, until the election is over. The only thing that might ever change that dynamic is if they lose circulation, and I don't think that's going to happen very soon in Lalaland.

Posted by: katomar on November 7, 2005 11:04 AM

8. Katomar,

Don't blink but one of Pravda-Izvestia's (PI) lead stories reports circulation down by 9% from one year ago. As one who grew up "reading" Blondie and Beetle Bailey in the 50's, I am encouraged to see people waking up as I did when I flushed the Pi$$-Eye some years back.

I liken it to the famous Winston Churchill (world's greatest man of the 20th century) quote, "Any 20-year old man who is not a liberal doesn't have a heart and any 40-year old man who is not a conservative doesn't have a brain".

Perhaps some Puget Sounders (maybe even Seattleites) are growing up....

Posted by: Saltherring on November 7, 2005 11:48 AM

9. I have no doubt that there were many illegally registered voters in the last election. I would, however, be careful when accusing people who use a commercial mail box. For the last several years we have spent winters in a trailer on a lot in Yuma, AZ. Since we left our home in October for points south, we had our ballots sent to a commercial box to be forwarded to us wherever we were at voting time.

Posted by: John on November 7, 2005 11:50 AM

10. John-

It is illegal to list a mailbox as your residence. A mailing address is different that your residence address. Simply forwarding it to a mailbox isn't illegal. Saying you live at that mailbox is. That is what all theses folks (less the ones the Republicans screwed up) are accused of doing and why they are being challenged.

By the way, if you are using a mailbox as your legal residence (as opposed to your mailing address), you may want to think about changing that as you are commiting a crime.

Posted by: Mike H on November 7, 2005 11:57 AM

11. John -- using a commercial mail box as a mailing address for receipt of elections correspondence is entirely legitimate. Claiming the mail box company as a voting residence address is illegal and the reason for the challenges.

Posted by: Stefan Sharkansky on November 7, 2005 11:57 AM

12. Sadly and pathetically, I admit that I kind of LOVE this last minute SH*T-THROWING politics. It brings out the worst in people....but is also quite revealing.
Berkoshitz and his campaign CLOWN are defined as follows:
clown--(n)
*** a dude ill-bred person
***a fool, jester or comedian in a play OR OTHER ENTERTAINMENT (elections are entertainment for these goofballs)
***a grotesquely dressed comedy performer in a circus.
***One who habitually plays the buffoon.

Need I say any more?

Posted by: Mr. Cynical on November 7, 2005 11:57 AM

13. Hi, John,

Your point is well taken that some people legitimately use either a public or private mailbox as a mailing address .

For snowbirds, retirees traveling around the country via motorhome, people with jobs that keep them constantly moving from place to place, students who may be changing apartments in their college town frequently, having a stable mailing address can be an effective way to manage one's mail, including ballots, and voter's guides.

However, no-one is being challenged because they have a POB or PMB as their mailing address. Having a seperate mailing address is perfectly fine.

The people challenged are being challenged because they have provided no physical address as their permanent legal address as required by law. Nobody's legal address is a PO Box.

These voters have provided PO Boxes, Public Mail Boxes, or storage units as their permanent legal physical address, in violation of the law. This was not a violation they committed unknowingly, either.

This is clearly spelled out on the original voter registration form as illegal, and those who have registered that way signed an oath stating that they physically lived or maintained their legal residence at the address provided.

Nobody lives in a 4" x 6" mailbox, unless they are Thumbelina.

Posted by: Insider on November 7, 2005 12:09 PM

14. Stefan,

I am curious. Do these folks say these "addresses" are where they live. Or where they receive mail? I am just curious. I am not sure if lack of physical address consitutes an illegal registration. You would know this point better then me. Just curious. I know one can be registered and not live in a jurisdiction. For example, I lived in NYC for 5 years and still voted in Washington State. I had a address in New York, but make no mistake I was a registered Washington State voter. Do you know if it is illegal to use a UPS store as an address for getting ones registeration? I just do not know.

Thanks

Posted by: Once AT City on November 7, 2005 12:15 PM

15. John's case raises an interesting aspect of the right to vote discussion. John is a rolling stone, who has little or no roots in any local jurisdiction. Does it even make sense for John to vote? Well, I suppose he should vote in national elections. But what about state and local? What stake does John have in those races?

I want John to vote, and he should probably vote in all races for the jurisdiction he is claiming as his residence at the time (assuming he has met residency requirements), but as more and more people migrate like John, the whole concept of federalism is challenged.

Sorry for the side tracking... back to the regularly scheduled hand-wringing... :)

Posted by: huckleberry on November 7, 2005 12:16 PM

16. Once At City,

The idea behind voter registration is that you give a damn about who represents you in city, county, and state legislative districts. In order to provide you with legitimate representation, you need to have a stake in a local district, i.e., you need to actually live somewhere. I suspect that you do not give a damn about local representation, that you just want to vote in the big races, you know, president, governor, senator.

Good God, we have lost control of our government!!!

Posted by: huckleberry on November 7, 2005 12:20 PM

17. Saltherring,
A FYI - Churchill never said the Quote about Twenty/Liberal/Forty/Conservative. It's an urban legend. But since you are such a scholar of Churchill you probably already knew that.

Posted by: Robert on November 7, 2005 12:25 PM

18. Washington never cut down a cherry tree and claimed he couldn't tell a lie. So what's your point, Robert?

Posted by: Danny on November 7, 2005 12:29 PM

19. Danny,

I'm just correcting the record. What's your point?

"I liken it to the famous Winston Churchill (world's greatest man of the 20th century) quote, "Any 20-year old man who is not a liberal doesn't have a heart and any 40-year old man who is not a conservative doesn't have a brain"."

http://www.winstonchurchill.org/i4a/pages/index.cfm?pageid=112
"Conservative by the time you're 35"
"If you're not a liberal when you're 25, you have no heart. If you're not a conservative by the time you're 35, you have no brain." There is no record of anyone hearing Churchill say this. Paul Addison of Edinburgh University makes this comment: "Surely Churchill can't have used the words attributed to him. He'd been a Conservative at 15 and a Liberal at 35! And would he have talked so disrespectfully

Posted by: Robert on November 7, 2005 12:33 PM

20. Robert,

Whether Churchill said it or not, someone needed to. And who is your man of the 20th century, Lenin or Mao?

Aside from that, most people gain some measure of wisdom as they advance in age. Listening to the ramblings of the looney leftists who troll this website, most must post between bong hits at the Evergreen State College.

Posted by: Saltherring on November 7, 2005 01:50 PM

21. Hmm, most curious. 181 voters who say they live at a private mail box company on their voter registration did so at PMB companies within a couple blocks of:

SEATTLE CENTRAL COMMUNITY COLLEGE!!!!!!!!

Still have doubts about organized voter fraud in King County?

Posted by: JC Bob on November 7, 2005 02:18 PM

22. I can't help but wonder if UPS, itself, might not be interested in knowing that it's facilities are being used for voter fraud. As a rule, they are very aggressive in exposing theft or illicit drug shipping and other such crimes.

I am not sure what, if anything, they could do about it, though.

alaric

Posted by: alaric on November 7, 2005 02:28 PM

23. Sadly and pathetically, I admit that I kind of LOVE this last minute SH*T-THROWING politics.

I'm just happy that we're in the game, and it's not one way.

Posted by: South County on November 7, 2005 02:52 PM

24. Huckleberry,

Because we are unfamiliar with each other I will assume the tenor of your response to me it more from a general flustration about this issue then with me in particular.

I am not sure Huckly how familiar you are or concerned you are with local issues, but I very much am. Moreso than you incorrectly have assume. For this I am sorry. i should have done a better job of giving more backgroud on myself.

I do care very much about local politics and governance. I am a native of the area. While out of state I kept in touch and voted at ALL elections because I always intended to return home.

Forgive me, I did not get my question answered. Is it illegal to have a PO BOX as a address or mailing address? I DO NOT KNOW> I am NOT taking a position on what the GOP is questioning. I was asking a FREAKING QUESTION, I thought respectfully HUCKLEBERRY!

Posted by: Once AT CIty on November 7, 2005 03:15 PM

25. City... didn't mean to vent at you specifically, but you wandered into my line of fire. Sorry.

But please help me understand. Why would you live in New York City for 5 years and never re-register to vote in the legislative district, county, and city where you live? I don't get it.

Also, what local issues do you care about? Just curious...

Posted by: huckleberry on November 7, 2005 04:19 PM

26. City... in answer to your question...

To be properly registered, you need to supply the county with your place of residence in Washington State. This address will be used to assign you to a precinct and a polling place. If you receive your mail in another place, say in your temporary residence in NYC, or at a local PO Box, then supply that address as your mailing address. If you do not have an actual residence in Washington State, like, say, if you moved to NYC after college and your parents retired and moved to Arizona, then you are no longer a resident of Washington State and have no business registering to vote here. Tom Foley got confused by this one, too.

I hope this helps you and anyone else still confused by this.

Posted by: huckleberry on November 7, 2005 04:28 PM

27. Who's in charge of the morning bathroom schedule?

Posted by: esseff on November 7, 2005 04:57 PM

28. City,

There are some exceptions, like military, college, etc. The address below will get you to Washington State law on Elections.

http://www.leg.wa.gov/rcw/index.cfm?fuseaction=title&title=29A

Posted by: sgmmac on November 7, 2005 06:07 PM

29. anybody check those shipping containers at the ports for more "resident voters?" what a joke for an elections system--and we sneer at third world countries?! the voter apathy in King County is sickening;

Posted by: Jimmie-howya-doin on November 8, 2005 12:11 AM

30. I wonder if an orchestrated mass mailing to these mail boxes could possibly bring a fair amount of media attention to them.
Suggestions might be fliers with a picture of Dean Logan campaining agains't Castro for Cuba?
Or fliers " VOTE EARLY VOTE OFTEN "

Posted by: Terry Clark Co. on November 8, 2005 07:32 AM

31. Huckleberry,

Thank you sincerely for your email. I appreciate your response and clarification.

Maybe I should have registered to vote in NYC when I was there, but did not cause I care/cared at the time more about what was going on in Washington. I was there 94-97. So this was about the time Sound Transit was lying to people and so on. Issues that concern me include public safety (neighbor watch efforts and good police relations.....very pro-police union), parks and libary investments, school choice (so far still hasn't happened in washington state, but keep voting for it when I get a chance), sensible transportation improvements (not always with vote, but with communciating with state and federal electeds).

For the record, I voted for Rossi. I was very disappointed in what happened last year. I was very sincere in wondering about what the ground rules are on "legal registration." While I am not a GOPer, I am certainly NOT a DEMO either. So I find it very easy to believe DEMOs in KING COunty would be up to something what gives them an advantage, for sure.

I just wanted more input on this item that was just raised with addresses at Mail box Etc. Very Interesting.

Thanks Huckleberry. Have a good one. Huckle.......down with the Monorail? You like me now. :0)

Posted by: Once At City on November 8, 2005 08:19 AM

32. Once At City:

I never sent you an e-mail. Must have been a copy cat.

It sounds like you are giving serious thought to local issues, and if you are committed to living in Seattle, and paying taxes to support Seattle, you have every right to vote there.

As for liking you, I neither dislike you nor like you, because I don't know you. How you voted in 2004 or are likely to vote in 2005 would have little impact on how well I like you.

Posted by: huckleberry on November 8, 2005 09:49 AM

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