November 01, 2005
It costs more, but offers less value (II)
The state's asphalt executives and bond lawyers must be encouraged by the latest KING-5 poll showing that support for I-912 is softening. Nevertheless, voters still have doubts about the gas tax:
In September, 65 percent said they didn't think the state would spend the gas tax money responsibly. That has gone down slightly.
But only slightly. Can't imagine why.
Oh, wait. "Unwanted Sequim rest area might be pulled if gas tax repeal initiative is passed".
There might be better uses for $2.5 million in road money than building an unwanted rest stop on Sequim's east side, one local state legislator said Thursday.
However, much depends on whether an initiative to roll back gasoline tax increases passes on Nov. 8.
The gas tax: it costs more, but you get an unwanted rest area for free!
Posted by Stefan Sharkansky at November 01, 2005
11:59 PM | Email This
Based upon the people fed up with this state
Based upon all other gas tax measures voted on by people in this state
I912 will pass
2. more waste ! no more new lanes !
yet we have miles and miles of sound wall on the freeways
that do nothing for traffic
but increase the value of the houses next to the freeway !
glad i could help pay for that
wish somebody would do that for me ?
but then i choose not to live near the freeway
knowing about the noise from the freeways
yes im bitter after watching them build the sound walls for years, i have to wonder what olympia has been thinking !
not only have they thrown away all that money
but they threaten us over they,re costly mistakes
as if they didnt know about the improvements that are needed. while they threw away our money on sound walls that havent done a single thing to releave traffic congestion
my question for olympia is why ?
If normal taxpaying people knew what the landscaped lids are, a lot more would be voting yes.
A sound wall doesn't relieve congestion.
A filmsy cable barrier doesn't stop accidents and critters don't need 9 bridges to cross I-90 to mate.
To paraphrase, support for increased transportation spending represents the triumph of hope over experience.
I-912 supporters point out the credibilty gap. Opponents seek to exploit the gullibility gap.
When you consider the cost of State Transportation Projects consider this:
Look at the pictures of this bridge:
Think about how much it would cost in Washington.
The Millau Viaduct cost...
350 Million dollars.
If surrender monkeys can build that bridge for 350 million, maybe we should be contracting State work to them.
The Seattle Slimes had a article about a proposal to replace the Alaska Way Viaduct with a cable stayed structure like the Millau Viaduct, in over all scope the projects are similar in scope, length of structure etc...
The Alaska Way estimate for a cable stayed solution:
The Millau Viaduct
7x in Washington State.
What's wrong with this picture?
Yes on 912, will begin to fix what's wrong with the picture.
I like the pictures! Where in France is it?
7. The way the trolls financed those "emergency" projects is partial funding at best. It reminds me of the 70's and 80's when driving into Seattle on I-5 you could see these bridges half finished waiting to be completed.
The 520 project wouldn't even be half way across the lake then it's "get the swim suit out".
Letting I912 fail is letting Olympia into your wallet AGAIN AND AGAIN to finish the emergency they created.
8. I'm supposed to believe King 5 poll? They are a news agency and not even an unbiased one. They have a definate agenda, and their poll doesn't mean squat...but lots of sheeples will believe it.
This poll doesn't even have a sample size or where the sample was taken from.
When you consider all the vile threats by lawmakers about "secession" of gas tax money for central Puget Sound counties (see Could Central Sound keep money if gas tax is repealed?), it is all the more reason why I-912 should pass.
Need I say more?
10. Let's not forget all the Fish Crossing signs in Snohomish County. I have yet to see a fish cross the road or even evidence that one tried! YES on 912!
11. fish crossing signs?????????
Map in upper right of page south central France.
I tried to post the link to the Google satellite image but the post errored on the link. Search in google maps for Millau France and zoom in under the satellite view you'll see it under construction.
13. Remember we currently pay .288 cents per gallon for state gas tax, and .244 cents per gallon for federal gas tax. That's .532 cents per gallon of gas.
***YES ON I-912***
14. They haven't shown any stewardship with the tax money we have already been giving them. They continue to resist building new roads, and only talk about fixing the current roads (which will do nothing to ease traffic congestion). They do not deserve any more of our money at the present time.
Yes on 912
15. I made my feeling known on Boger king website after 912 debate. Yes on 912!! DoT clowns are useless!!
16. Correction Bloger King 5.
Off topic here...
I think someone needs to start using the handle of "Surrender Monkey" in the future here.
I think the fish crossing signs are for when Snohomish County floods, which it's wont to do every few years because half of the buildings were stragically placed in the middle of old cow pastures. A $150 fish crossing sign which is mildly amusing has more cost benefits than other projects at least.
Perhaps a better sign would be to warn idiot drivers off from crossing flooded roadways.
18. Wee wee! Ze grat strookture only took 350 million of your dollars to build. Ve vill happily replace ze viaduct for zat price.
19. Jay vole there surrendermonkey.
Here is a novel idea: If downtown Seattle and Seattle commuters want a new viaduct and a new 520 bridge, PUT TOLLS ON THEM! Gig Harbor got this rammed down their throats. Why not the liberals?
Looking forward to voting "YES" on I-912!
21. Right on Road Driver. I for one am sick of hearing about how 9 cents a gallon will save my life if an earthquake hits while I'm on the road. HEY 'Limpia, undo the congestion and there will be less a chance we're on the road when the quake hits. But really, do you thing you can build something that will withstand a quake and about 50 aftershocks?
If I 912 passes, as expected, the biggest message it will send is that more than half the voters in the state don't want to pay to fix the roads they use.
The next big vote on transportation will be about transit - to extend light rail and other Sound Transit services. Expect approval - it is the most popular alternative to traffic in recent surveys, everywhere is King County, not just Seattle.
Light rail will be the winner if I-912 fails and roads will take a back seat again.
One of the questions I have been unsuccessful in getting the WSDOT to answer is:
Why if the Port Angeles graving dock fiasco is only going to cost Washington taxpayers $58 million, has the WSDOT earmarked $162 million from the 2005 gas tax increase for the Hood Canal Bridge project.
By the way, the original budget of the Hood Canal Bridge project which included building a state-owned graving docks was $261 million. Yes, a meer 62 precent cost growth. But I bet you that if the Hood Canal Bridge project is completed for a penny less than $423 million, the sheeple of Washington will be told that the project was completed on-time and under budget.
People like you both amaze and amuse me to no end.
The gas tax that is addressed by I-912 does nothing whatsoever to fix the roads we use. Most of the new gas tax will go to things not associated with transportation at all. If we got lucky (and only with the discretion of those who have the power to funnel the money where they like) a token effort will be made to build some more HOV lanes out of existing multi-purpose lanes (paint some lines). Mark my words--nothing more. It will only allow transportation to become worse, more costly and more dangerous, but you can feeeeel better about yourself. Your refusal to pay attention to the facts and interpret what they mean amounts to nothing more than invincible stupidity. When you bought the pretext the Democrats provided for the gas tax, you were operating on blind faith. You trust Christine Gregoire despite the FACTS? Why, because of her record, you’re kidding? Because she is a Democrat? If Governor Rossi ever proposed such a blank check, I'd vote for I-912.
Nearly all of us want to fix transportation. The new gas tax is not about transportation, it is about Democrats filling holes in the budget without cutting other pork programs. "Transportation" is the Boob Bait and Bubba's like you bite every time.
The key problem with the new gas tax is VERY SIMPLE--there is no reason for any responsible sane person to believe the gas tax will be used to improve ANYTHING for the citizens of our region. There is absolutely no accountability, and no accountability amounts to a license to steal and come back next year for more. They love your ignorance and stupidity because it provides them with the power to take your life's production and funnel it for their benefit. If you let them get away with this, they will be back for more and there will be no limits to how much they will tax, regulate, and socialize our area into economic crisis.
The "popularity" of self destruction is not justification, but simplemindedness. Our areas population is no where near dense enough to justify large scale mass transit systems, and our economy relies on roads to survive you friggin' idiot. If you live in the greater Seattle area, your economic well being is at stake along with the rest of us. You may be right about transit, it certainly is nothing to be proud of. While you are busily cruising the neighbor’s yards on foot for shoe polish, the rest of us must use roads to survive.
Nevertheless you willingly accept the singularly insane rationale of people like Sims, Gregoire, Murray, and Cantwell, that strangling the goose that lays the Golden egg (our highway system) is the way to produce economic prosperity. Take your dim-witted enviro-freakism and your ballot against I-912 and stuff them both up your dumb a$$. By the way, your shoes might shine, but they’re stinky, look into it.
25. Since Gregoire says she thinks the viaduct is likely to collapse and kill hundreds,
WHY WON'T SHE FUND FIXING IT?
I don't agree with the idea that the Alaskan Way Viaduct is our most important transportation priority, but . . .
A Monday, September 19, 2005 Seattle Times article by Ralph Thomas quoted Gov. Christine Gregoire as saying that “state engineers told her the viaduct [Alaskan Way Viaduct] probably would have collapsed if the 2001 Nisqually earthquake had lasted 15 more seconds.” O.K., maybe, so what?
42 PEOPLE DEAD
It also cited “Concerns about the viaduct's safety surfaced at least by 1989, when an earthquake in the Bay Area pancaked [sic] a similar elevated freeway, killing 42 people.” and the fact that “In 1996, a study found the structure was built on soil that could liquefy in an earthquake. It said the viaduct needed nearly $350 million in seismic upgrades. Since the 2001 Nisqually quake, the viaduct has shifted more than four inches. If it moves much more, the state plans to shut it down. Our best advice is to get off it five minutes before the next quake, state Department of Transportation spokeswoman Linda Mullen quipped earlier this year." Wow, this sounds really serious to me.
IMPORTANT ENOUGH TO LIE
While the elevated freeway in the Bay area is not structurally similar to the Alaskan Way Viaduct, and liquefaction had nothing to do with the failure of the Bay Area structure, it is important to understand that liquefaction will only occur in a seismic event serious enough to destroy many other downtown structures (also killing hundreds). This isn’t an excuse to do nothing, just a way to put the real problem into perspective. Gregoire and her minions prove that they know little about earthquakes, and that they will use appeals to fear, rather than rational transportation planning.
Jane Milhans, sponsor of I-912, had it right when she said “All this has led to the widespread belief that those responsible for spending our transportation dollars are hostile to the vast majority of us who drive our own cars to work, school, church and the market. And Olympia’s mammoth new gas tax increase proves nothing has changed. The new gas tax won’t complete the cross-base highway, it won’t solve the problems on Highway 167 and it doesn’t add any new general-purpose lanes on I-5 to relieve congestion in Pierce County.” Most importantly, the 9.5-cent gas tax hike doesn’t begin to solve any of the problems--they say–pose risks to users of the Alaskan Way Viaduct.
ETHICISTS ALL AGREE
Yet absurdly enough, the same article goes on to wail in mock moral tones, “Politicians, clerics and ethicists agree we have a moral obligation to fix infrastructure such as highways and levees that we know pose a risk to the public.”
The real question is, IF GREGOIRE HONESTLY BELIEVES THAT THE LIVES of users of the Alaskan Way Viaduct ARE AT RISK, WHY DIDN’T SHE GUARANTEE THE PROJECT IS FUNDED instead preying on fear of disaster and death to pass a measure that does very little or nothing about it?
WILLING TO PAY?
The anti I-912 saying goes, “Voters want solutions,” they’ll say, “but they just aren’t willing to pay for them” and yet the very people who attempt to shame us all into submission, refuse to fund the very solutions they hand wring over. Milhans says, “While some politicians will tell you that the new revenue will fund important projects . . . the fact is that the DOT is not bound to complete any of them with the new funds.”
If Gregoire gave a $hit about anyone’s life but her own, she’d cut the “Katrina” crappola death and disaster angle and UNLIKE HER MORALLY AND ETHICALLY bankrupt COHORTS IN LOUISIANA, actually do something (anything) decisive about the problem. Gregoire is no better than they are.
The real facts about Initiative 912.
Washington state citizens want Initiative 912 because the 9.5-cent gas tax hike isn’t about transportation.
The gas tax is however about Governor Gregoire’s cynical insistence to tax without accountability.
Those who believe that the 9.5-cent gas tax has transportation issues as its purpose are blindly accepting a political bait and switch campaign of manipulation and lies in substitution for honest policy making.
What will we get either way?
Everything anyone needs to know about Initiative 912 is in the public record.
If she intended to use the revenues from the 9.5-cent gas tax hike to solve real basic problems, she would have committed them to specific projects.
Governor Gregoire refuses to tie taxes directly to specific projects because she doesn’t intend to be held responsible for any of the inevitable consequences of her governance.
Vote for I-912 and tell Gregoire and the Democrats in the legislature that you want them to fix transportation with REAL LEADERSHIP—CLEARLY DEFINED SOLUTIONS TO CLEARLY AND HONESTLY ASSESSED PROBLEMS—
NOT BLANK CHECKS!!!
Otherwise we will get more escalating traffic problems, escalating taxation for amorphous purposes, mass departure of business from our area, and economic instability.
Please think about it and VOTE YES I-912!!!