March 11, 2005
Junk Statistics, Again

Seattle's social services Mafia are terribly enamored of "disproportionality" junk science, and usually the local print media falls for it, hard. You know the scam: blacks are X percent of the local population but comprise some significantly higher percentage of those busted for street drug buys; those incarcerated; those failing to pass standardized tests in public schools; those with asthma; those fatally shot by police while threatening the lives of police; and so on.

Selectively insert Native Americans, Hispanics, maybe Asian Pacific Islanders; into some of those scenarios, lather, and rinse again. What usually washes out from the "findings" of "disproportionality" is a guilty-until-proven-innocent indictment of "the system," and dark intimations of "institutional racism." Guilty white liberals in Seattle just love to atone, this way. "There's still work to do," they tell each other somberly, over soy lattes and seitan cutlets.

And so it goes again, with the issuance this week of a "study" by a shadowy "coalition" with only the most obscure Web presence; and no contact person or phone number given on its press release. They're called the King County Coalition on Racial Disproportionality. That a well known local non-profit, foundation and judge lend their names to the publicity effort makes the lack of contact information on the press release even more curious. Did no one want to field calls on this?

Perhaps so, given how stale the refrain is getting.

"Children of Color Over-Represented in Child Welfare System in King County: African American and Native American Youth Disproportionately Represented" is the headline.

A county-wide coalition of child welfare and human services organizations today announced findings from its study indicating that children of color in King County are over-represented in the child welfare system and fare worse by all measures than their Caucasian counterparts. Although children of color are one-third of the child population in King County, they make up more than one-half of all children in foster care in the county.
..The study found that in King County a disproportionate number of African American and Native American families are referred for investigation, resulting in a disproportionate number of these youth being removed from their homes and placed in foster care; and they stay in foster care longer than their Caucasian counterparts.
African American and Native American children together make up eight percent of the child population in King County, but account for: 25 percent of the children accepted for investigation once they are referred to Child Protective Services; 33 percent of all children removed from their homes and placed in foster care; 50 percent of the children still in out-of-home care four years after placement.

Well, Jumped-Up Jesus In A Sidecar! Why might all that be? And whose responsibility is it to correct the "disproportionality?" It wouldn't have anything to do with absent or addled PARENTS would it? Naah.

I suppose it's tempting for small government types to say we should just do away with state-sponsored foster care. Well, I dunno, but let's see now....what sort of reactions would that set off? If the state wasn't paying foster parents, the ah, absenteee parents would have to pay them. Or find family members, or church-based institutions, or charities to shoulder the burdens of child-rearing. Or just buck up and do the job themselves, kinda like they're s'posed to.

Hmmmn.

Posted by Matt Rosenberg at March 11, 2005 09:39 AM | Email This
Comments
1. Matt....thank you for this article. It's so true, and no one ever says it, and until people recognize the problem it will never be addressed and fixed.I loved the soy latte image......I take it you aren't a native of nutville either?

Posted by: christmasghost on March 11, 2005 09:52 AM
2. This just shows how the work of the Bolshviks has a way to go yet -- the misery hasn't been spread evenly enough --- Tthere is too large of a disproportionate number of caucasian kids that aren't in STATE sponsored foster care.

Posted by: Bill on March 11, 2005 09:54 AM
3. Well, I don't know whatcha gonna do, but it'd better not involve religion or the churches.

Despite the fact that it actually worked for hundreds of years.

PC-ness is the social services equivalent of the foxes guarding the hen house.

If you know anything about foxes, that's a bigger insult than most people would realize.

Posted by: scott158 on March 11, 2005 09:55 AM
4. So if minorities are over represented in government entitlement programs it must be time for some affirmative action to get whitey better represented.

Posted by: Stitch on March 11, 2005 09:56 AM
5. cg, i come from a different nutville, Chicago.

Bill, I think you've hit on the union-sponsored solution. More WHITE kids in state-sponsored foster care. After all, due to the cultural biases of the investigators, they are probably overlooking just how poor a job many white parents are doing.

Posted by: Matt Rosenberg on March 11, 2005 09:58 AM
6. Matt,
I agree with you, but it is amazing that everyone buy the "junk science" when it comes to smoking and SHS. Maybe a review of that would be in order too.

Posted by: Bruce Kaye on March 11, 2005 10:04 AM
7. STATISTICS !! ... and then there was the statician who drowned in a lake with an average depth of 2 inches.

Posted by: Dave on March 11, 2005 10:06 AM
8. statician = statistician

Posted by: Dave on March 11, 2005 10:09 AM
9. So true, so true. "Institutional Racism" is the dirtiest phrase in the English language. I just heard some soy-latte drinking liberal on KCTS Connects last night whining about how closing some Seattle Public Schools was institutional racism. THEY HAVEN'T EVEN CLOSED ANY YET!!!! (although I think it's a great idea) What makes her think they're going to close "black" schools? In fact, two of the best schools in the district, Washington Middle School and Franklin High School, would, by most accounts, be considered "black" schools.

Posted by: Mark Griswold on March 11, 2005 10:18 AM
10. Contact information for the Task Force is available at the link you provided: "For more information, call Lyman Legters at 206.322.6711."

Posted by: Call me on March 11, 2005 10:22 AM
11. Yes, Lyman, thanks, but the lack of any contact info for the Coalition on the press release was puzzling.

At any rate, feel free to add any comments to this string you would like. We welcome dissenting views here.

Posted by: Matt Rosenberg on March 11, 2005 10:30 AM
12. hum, so king county's numbers are bad...
it would be interesting to see the numbers for a city that's supposedly doing it right...if they'd call it good that 3/4ths of the percentage of children are caucasion
cause that would just be rediculous. I suppose I share the sentiment that less emphasis should be placed on what the makeup of the kids are that are displaced and more emphasis should be placed on doing something about it

who's wasting my money to find out about the problem when we already know it exists?

sidenote: they should've compared the proportions to the national average instead of the city. isn't child welfare a national thing? or heck, even if it's a state thing I'd like to see the state numbers. I'd bet money that washington "fits in"

Posted by: Eric on March 11, 2005 10:46 AM
13. The easy one here is that men (as a slight minority) are clearly abused by the biased justice system. Rape laws are the most gender-biased, with virtually all persons charged or incarcerated being male. Clearly something is very wrong with the laws!

(/sarcasm off)

Posted by: Dishman on March 11, 2005 10:56 AM
14. yeah, lets not solve problems, lets just complain we don't like the way the problem looks like. you'd think from the article that if the ratios were even-steven that the poor black/nativeA kids left in the system would feel automatically feel better about themselves. Quote poor black/nativeA kid, "Yeah it used to suck being a foster kid, but now that I see more white kids in the orphanage I feel so much better about still being left behind."

Here are some minor things that might throw off the numbers.... geniuses.

Who might have a..
- Higher % of children that come from a single parent family?
- Higher % of abandonment/removal from imprisoned/dead/high-risk action parents?
- Higher % of children born to women who used children to raise their welfare payments?
- Higher % of women that are careless with sexual relationships, birth control are careless with providing a stable family for their children?

so lets say the numbers of white kids vs non-white kids are remotely 50/50 from the above descrepancy.

now lets go adopt the children.. you have 80% of white families adopting most of the white kids and 20% of the non-white kids adopting most of the non-white kids.

wow... hey look what the numbers find. the non-white kids are left behind. color me surprised.

Posted by: David on March 11, 2005 11:31 AM
15. If you want more of something you pay for it.
If you want less of somehting you tax it.

Posted by: Eriks on March 11, 2005 11:38 AM
16. OK, I'll bite...

I really don't understand your post, Matt. You're arguing that disproportionality is junk science, but you don't seem to be arguing that disproportionality exists. Or are you? What's the stale refrain?

If you're arguing that people are drawing the wrong conclusions and taking the wrong approach, what do you suggest?

I happen to think that the idea that the cause is crappy parenting is a tired refrain and more a symptom than a cause. Yes, most people have power to better their situations if they put their minds to it, but I think it's wrong to ignore historical events when addressing these issues.

Should individuals shoulder the blame and guilt for racism? No, not unless they're racist. Should government try it's best to address the social ills created by centuries of overt racism and what amounted to "affirmative action" for whites (i.e., good old boy network)? Absolutely!

Not so long ago, people here were praising Wayne Perryman for attacking the historical atrocities that Democrats committed against blacks. What do you think those things did?

If government is powerful enough to do horrible things like contribute to the creation of ghettoes, etc., why shouldn't we be pressing it do something good--and not just write off past mistakes?

Posted by: ChrisW on March 11, 2005 11:49 AM
17. Lately the stat has been coming up that out of wedlock birth rate is 70% in the black community while it is 30% for the entire US populace. The governing solution is to make the father accountable- (yeah, accountable for

After conception, the father has absolutely NO choice in what happens to the kid, even if he wanted to he is not legally entitled to any role in the childs life. In fact the welfare system REWARDS single moms for not getting married and continuing to have children out of wedlock.


Posted by: Andy on March 11, 2005 11:49 AM
18. The problem here is not whites being under-represented. It is that we white folks are over-represented as "being white". That's right folks, we may not all be white as the driven snow. I know for myself, although considered by the state to be "W" on all their forms, (before I started answering; "other" with the comment; "none of your damn business"), I have some Native American aka "Indian" blood in me, so add an "I". My kids grandma's father is "Spanish Puerto Rican" which is what...an "H"? One of my great great grandfathers was from Tipperery in Ireland, so that would be a "T" right? And on my mothers side there is some East German, so add an "E" in there. So, adding up the letters we get; W-H-I-T-E. I guess if you're white you can claim to be a lot of things! I think the state should pay for a complete search of our heritage so we can answer their forms truthfully. Let's see...how many programs does that qualify my kids for?$$$$$

Posted by: Scott on March 11, 2005 11:59 AM
19. Just exactly what is a "person of color?" Are they green, orange, red, lavender, aqua-marine? Oh how I hate that term which is so embraced by the loonie-left- a term which by its very nature divides us as Americans-A term invented by the same people who want to be treated equally and seen as the same. Yeah, right! The only "people of color" that I see around here are bleeding heart guilt-ridden Seattle pinkos!

Posted by: GraniteStater on March 11, 2005 12:11 PM
20. Scott, ha! I love it! You are so right. If the libs want to talk about "institutional racism" let's talk about the forms. I refuse to mark any of the boxes any more and, hmm, I feel a good idea for a bill for next years session: no asking what race people are. I remember when I joined the navy the recruiter asked me what race I was and I said White. Then he asked me if I had any Hispanic blood in me. I said I had a little bit of Spanish blood in me. He told me to mark the Hispanic box. Why is the military trying to get numbers up? Maybe they know the truth, that this is all just a bunch of BS and they have to pad the numbers for all the pinko commie anti-everything crowd because Uncle Sam has become a snivling househusband to the whiney Aunt Hillary (or Barbara or Carol Mausley Braun, etc)

Posted by: Mark Griswold on March 11, 2005 12:27 PM
21. so what are we supposed to do? Racially consider the investigated children and say, "sorry, we've met our quota of ( N. Amer.) children"?? Leave needy children out? (Then watch them scream!)


Maybe we're supposed to make these places Better than home, (but not Actually home---family is such a loaded concept these days.)

Are these stats saying that all these many decades (over 4) of funding specialty programs for minorities hasn't worked?--that there is still a higher incidence of problems despite TWO GENERATIONS of teaching both non-whites and whites?

Perhaps I should infer from this that no one can ever change--whites are ever powerful and prejudiced, non-whites are ever victims of white oppression. (If change can never happen, then let's stop the useless flow of money now.)

Perhaps the system is a failure and needs to be re-vamped--(I'm all for that!)

Or maybe, as Matt radically suggested, we should concentrate on strengthening family and religious ties, seein' how it's worked so well since time immemorial.

Posted by: singer on March 11, 2005 01:52 PM
22. Why do conservatives complain that they are underrepresented and are victims of discrimination in academia based on the same sort of "disproportionality" studies? That is either stupid, hypocritical, or both.

Posted by: headless lucy on March 11, 2005 01:57 PM
23. Headless - beacuse libs use these bogus statistics to ram new unwarranted programs down our throats.

Posted by: Fred on March 11, 2005 02:18 PM
24. Maybe the freemarket of ideas in academia proves your ideas are crappy? It's just the invisible hand separating the wheat from the chaff. You wouldn't want to hinder that ,would you?

Posted by: headless lucy on March 11, 2005 02:44 PM
25. Academia proving my ideas are crappy. Thank you for the compliment, you made my weekend. With the likes of Ward Churchill in academia, the people that preach everything but do nothing that is prime! I like to learn from people that have accomplished what they are teaching. I have plenty of degrees, so I know the difference. This in not meant to be a put down to all the great teachers and professors, just the concept if it comes from academia - the tolarant liberal melting pot - it must be good.

Posted by: Fred on March 11, 2005 03:12 PM
26. Lucy,

The freemarket of ideas in academia are called theories. They remain theory until proven fact. If you don't know the difference between theory and fact, please allow me to explain.

In theory, Washington State held an election that was a "model to the world." But facts show that there were thousands of errors that so muddled the results that no one can be declared a winner by an margin greater than the rate errors.

Posted by: Ken on March 11, 2005 03:50 PM
27. I've been a Cop for 17 years now....When I worked drugs in the Maple Valley area I arrested 98% white suspects....When I worked street dealers at 3/Yesler I arrested 90% black suspects. I know it's disproportionate to the population but I haven't figured out an affirmative action program for white dealers on Yesler and black dealers in Maple Valley..I'll work on it. One more thing....I have arrested no Koreans, Japanese or Chinese for drug dealing yet...Being the racist cop that the liberals say I am, I will target those peoples now. As a matter of fact I was having lunch in a restaurant in Chinatown yesterday. The owners son who is Chinese, promises to help me balance my numbers by going out and doing a crime so I can arrest him. Scheduling is a problem since he works from 8 am till 10 PM 7 days a week at the restaurant...In his free time he is a real estate agent....Doesn't leave much time for him to do a crime....What a concept huh? We've tenatively penciled in a crime spree for the fall of 07 if he can get the time off....I'll report back....

Posted by: Sierradog on March 11, 2005 05:50 PM
28. Yes, please get that report on my desk in the morning, Officer Sierradog. :)

Seriously, I'm persistently bothered by the rote conservative line that racial disproportionality in education, wealth, and prison populations simply has to do with poor individual decision making.

I don't think the problem in our country can be solved just by the police, the judicial system, the education system, the social services system, or individuals making better choices. I think it requires a coordinated effort by all these, which we don't have right now.

Most of what I hear from conservatives is that the problems seems to be 100% resolvable by individuals making better choices. Or another favorite line is why don't they have better leaders who can define what blacks want? As if whites have a coherent leadership on what whites want...

Posted by: ChrisW on March 11, 2005 08:55 PM
29. Yes, please get that report on my desk in the morning, Officer Sierradog. :)

Seriously, I'm persistently bothered by the rote conservative line that racial disproportionality in education, wealth, and prison populations simply has to do with poor individual decision making.

I don't think the problem in our country can be solved just by the police, the judicial system, the education system, the social services system, or individuals making better choices. I think it requires a coordinated effort by all these, which we don't have right now.

Most of what I hear from conservatives is that the problems seems to be 100% resolvable by individuals making better choices. Or another favorite line is why don't they have better leaders who can define what blacks want? As if whites have a coherent leadership on what whites want...

Posted by: ChrisW on March 11, 2005 08:55 PM
30. headless lucy "just the invisible hand separating the wheat from the chaff. You wouldn't want to hinder that ,would you?"

Such a separating should not be dependent upon being the "right" or "wrong" color/race/ethnicity.

Are you wheat or chaff, Lucy?
Or are you the "invisible hand"?
If you are, please try using invisible typing, you would make more sense.

Posted by: social engineer on March 11, 2005 09:30 PM
31. The only thing that statistics prove is that figures can lie, and liars can figure.

Posted by: cynic on March 11, 2005 09:41 PM
32. You forgot to mention peruvians. Let's get ALL the interest groups in here, now... :-)

Posted by: Michele on March 11, 2005 09:59 PM
33. Get those all-important FATHERS back into the african-american home and these kids won't need to be over-representing themselves in these 'studies'. It's positively tragic what the absence of fathers is doing to these kids. one study shows that the tone of emotional well-being for girls is set by the FATHER, not the mother. Get fathers back into the picture and these kids will do so much better!

Seitan cutlets? Yechhh

Posted by: Michele on March 11, 2005 10:06 PM
34. This one is a classic, Matt.

I've never quite understood the logic behind biting the hand that feeds you. What exactly are these people complaining about, anyway? That white Seattle liberals are willing to pay to keep children off the streets?

Clearly, they are blaming the wrong people for all of this "disproportionality." If they aren't going to appreciate the work done on their behalf, I would be more than happy to see it stop.

Posted by: DeadManVoting (aka Iguana) on March 11, 2005 10:31 PM
35. Chris W.

Jeez! Another White Hater! Why are there so few whites in the NBA Chris? Is it discrimination? Racism?
Why don't you genuine racists ever answer questions like that?
You assign collective guilt for all the evils of the world to Whites. They are not only personally responsible for their own actions but collectively responsible for slavery and "institutional racism." BUT... You will treat NO OTHER race collectively! "Blacks as a group aren't responsible for their station in life." AND you white haters won't even hold Blacks PERSONALLY responsible for bad behavior because of "institutional racism." We see you for what you are........RACIST

Posted by: pajamazon on March 12, 2005 07:35 AM
36. I have to weigh in on Lucy's comment about academia being a free market. I think she is confusing an economic free market (to which Adam Smith's invisible hand would apply) with a free market of ideas, which is a whole different ball game.

Academia stops being an economic free market when professors are granted tenure and when the only consumers in the marketplace are of an age where their decision-making skills ("which elective shall I take this semester?") are still being formed.

As for academia being a free market of ideas, I don't buy that one either. In any given week, I can cite at least one case of conservatives somewhere on a campus, peacably and legally assembled, being run off campus through physical threats and violence from lefty-liberals.

In many years of watching, I have yet to see the opposite take place (conservatives violently opposing the right of liberals to peacably assemble). Why is that, Lucy? And given that, can you truly call that a free marketplace of ideas? Or of just YOUR ideas?

Posted by: Jeff Brazill on March 13, 2005 12:11 AM
37. Dear Poopypajamazon,

"Jeez! Another White Hater! Why are there so few whites in the NBA Chris? Is it discrimination? Racism?
Why don't you genuine racists ever answer questions like that? [...and so on...]"

Did you even read my post before responding? I didn't use the word hate or racist to refer to anyone on this blog. In fact I said I don't believe whites should feel collective guilt--quite the opposite. I simply placed the role of FIXING some of these issues on the government. You may not like the solutions proposed, but simply suggesting that the only reason that African Americans have not had more success is because of personal issues is a big mistake. I do throw better personal decisions by individuals as ONE piece of the problem--I don't, like you, suggest that it's the 100% key defining cause. Forgive me if I misrepresented your thinking on this, but for cryin' out loud, you used quotes to respond to me that weren't MY quotes.

As for the NBA analogy: I haven't heard any credible complaints from white players that they have been systematically denied positions or playtime because they're white. In basketball there's a public and pretty objective way to tell who the good players are. They score X points, get X rebounds, etc. in a PUBLIC arena. We don't have the benefit of a public display of talent in most workplaces. We simply have to trust that CEOs and executives are behind their closed doors truly considering skills and talents and being fair about who gets the opportunity.

When there's evidence that some of these folks aren't fair or very smart--perhaps they're caught referring to people as "black jellybeans" or something worse--then it's time to slap them a bit.

Posted by: ChrisW on March 13, 2005 09:12 AM
38. Lucy, where in acedemia does this "free marketplace of ideas" exist? I've never seen it. Where on a campus can you even ask questions such as the following;
Is homosexuality a curable mental disorder?
Is aborting a fetus really a form of extreme selfishness?
Is war really a good thing for the world if the good guys win?
Is there a point at which too much taxation can lead to economic ruin?
Is it possible racisim "from" minorities is on the rise?
I need not even believe these things may be true, but just bringing them up would get me run off any campus in the U.S., especially if I were a professor.

Posted by: Scott on March 14, 2005 10:35 AM
39. You can ask these questions in any history or social science class where such questions are a part of the subject matter under study. What world do you live in? Could you get an unbiased explanation of evolution at Bob Jones University? No way!

Posted by: headless lucy on March 14, 2005 12:33 PM
40. To those of you who asked where the free marketplace of ideas exists check out this article (http://www.nytimes.com/2005/03/10/nyregion/10paddle.html) about a student teacher who was recently EXPELLED for writing his graduate thesis on the benefits of corporal punishment. This exemplary teacher didn't USE corporal punishment. He didn't even stongly encourage it. He simply said it might be something worth taking another look at in many of the states where it is banned. And what happened?! He was EXPELLED. Yea, headelss, some freedom.

Posted by: Mark Griswold on March 14, 2005 03:29 PM
41. Mark Griswold: I haven't read the article yet , but if it all checks out I will try to e-mail them and protest the action. I hate the politically correct equally as much as the knee-jerk Republican.

Posted by: s-choir on March 15, 2005 08:38 AM
42. Lucy, that's the problem. These subjects are not "under study" anywhere except in chuch sponsored studies, which are promptly discounted by the left as worthless religious brain washing. Neither is any serious study devoted to a whole bunch of other issues that need to be sorted out. Students are being "told" one way, the only way to think about these types of contentious and polarizing issues. And what they are being told is they must agree with the left wing solution/answer to them or else be labled a racist homophobic sexist right wing Limbaughian Nazi religous zelot. That's not a free marketplace of ideas.

Posted by: Scott on March 15, 2005 09:41 AM
43. The racism on this site is astounding. Take a look at yourselves.

Posted by: Helen on March 22, 2005 11:21 AM
44. Casey Family Programs has created a mini cottage industry surrounding "disproportionality" and fighting the evil white man who responsible for it. It's really sad because they have so much money, yet are clueless when it comes to addressing the true problems facing people of color.

Posted by: Jacque on March 23, 2005 03:22 PM
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